Which rules says you cant hold the committe boat?

Originally posted by JimC Originally posted by Reuben T Would I have been allowed to stand there holding my boat until the start? I've done that in the past. I was racing the Canoe on the Thames (not a clever idea, don't do this at home folks), the start area was considerably crowded, and manouvering the IC around was a bit sketchy, so I retreated to stand on a ledge next to the bank until a minute or a bit under to go, and things were safer for everyone. I think if you tried doing it tactically (ie anchor yourself in the middle of the line until the gun) you might be a bit vulnerable to Rule 2,

45 HAULING OUT; MAKING FAST; ANCHORING

A boat shall be afloat and off moorings at her preparatory signal. Thereafter, she shall not be hauled out or made fast except to bail out, reef sails or make repairs. She may anchor or the crew may stand on the bottom. She shall recover the anchor before continuing in the race unless she is unable to do so.

Originally posted by JimC  but I suspect the chief issue is that, if I read the rules right, whilst everyone might have to keep clear of you while you are "anchored",

23 CAPSIZED, ANCHORED OR AGROUND; RESCUING

If possible, a boat shall avoid a boat that is capsized or has not regained control after capsizing, is anchored or aground, or is trying to help a person or vessel in danger. A boat is capsized when her masthead is in the water.

Firstly, rule 45 makes it clear that a boat can be anchored, OR a boat can have her crew standing on the bottom.  Having crew standing on the bottom (and, obviously, hanging onto the boat), is not being 'anchored'.

Rule 23 applies to a boat that is anchored, but not to a boat that has a crew standing on the bottom (except for capsize or helping).

Secondly, rule 23 is not a right of way rule:  the obligation is to 'if possible ... avoid', not keep clear, and the other right of way rules in Section A are switched off (Preamble, Section D).

Originally posted by JimC  the second you jump in the boat you owe everyone around you room to keep clear under RRS15,

Rule 15 only applies to a boat that acquires right of way.

For a boat with crew standing on the bottom, rule 23 will not apply and Section A right of way rules (P/S, W/L etc) will still be applying, and the crew jumping in the boat will not cause the boat to acquire or lose right of way, so the jumping in won't trigger rule 15.

For a boat that is anchored, breaking the anchor out WILL switch rule 23 off, and switch the Section A right of way rules back on, so, depending on whether she is on Starboard, Leeward, etc the boat that was anchored may acquire right of way and a rule 15 limitation to give room to keep clear.

Originally posted by JimC and your chances of getting away from a crowded line cleanly and without needing to take a penalty must be pretty low.

I don't think it would be a real practical problem.  In this day and age, if conditions are so light or tide-bound that boats cannot manoeuvre properly in the starting area the RO should postpone or abandon the start until conditions are suitable for sailing.

If you do choose to anchor or put your crew overside, then you will normally pick your moment to let go at a time when you won't get into trouble.

Originally posted by JimC It seems to me the "touch but not hold" alteration made to App B3 is an alteration that might be wisely made by those classes that delete RRS31 in their SIs.

Must admit I've always inferred from RRS45 that the crew standing on the bottom counted as being anchored. That may not be a valid assumption of course. The reason for my inference is the rule heading being Hauling out, making fast and anchoring. Anchoring by standing on the bottom always seemed to me to be just another form of anchoring, which is permitted, as opposed to say tying on to a jetty, which isn't.

The situation I felt might be of dubious sporting status with respect to holding the boat whilst standing on the bottom would be if, with a dinghy, the crew held the boat fractionally short of the line in a close hauled position so as to occupy the ideal spot on the line, and then jumped in the boat during the last few seconds so as to obtain a perfect start.

Naturally this is a situation that would rarely occur since very few starts are run in such shallow water that this would be practical. Very hard for the RRS to include wordings for really bizarre circumstances like that...

Edited by JimC - 07 Dec 13 at 10:49am

An alternative - and in my opinion far more logical reading is that rule 23 applies to boats immobilised by their crew standing on the bottom.


The situation is common at some estuary venues - Maldon springs to mind - where racing starts as soon as there is deep enough water on the start line. The start is always against the current. Boats line up near the bank, with the crew in the water, then start to sail as late as possible.

Following up on Brass's suggestion I have contacted one of those who drafts the rules...

They have no problem with applying rule 23 to a boat held by a crew member standing on the bottom. Such a boat is secured firmly in one position, in other words "anchored".

As the verb "to anchor" is not defined in the racing rules then it is to be used in the sense ordinarily understood in nautical or general use. A dictionary definition gives the following:

Full Definition of ANCHOR

and so much less strain on the back - especially in a currentor in any wind....