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Correcting Course Sailed
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The Moo View Drop Down
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Posts: 809 		Post Options Post Options   Quote The Moo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Correcting Course Sailed
    Posted: 05 Dec 11 at 6:59pm
A bit of a bar room discussion yesterday which was not satisfactorily resolved, but I suspect we were looking at it too deeply!

If a mark is rounded the wrong way the competitor is expected to unwind themselves and pass the "string test".

If a competitor sails the wrong course by either missing a number of marks or rounding them in the wrong order, as soon as they realise should they also unwind by returning the way they came or is it in order to sail direct to the point where they started to go wrong and resail the correct course from that point?
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Posts: 1314 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Neptune Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 11 at 7:10pm
Direct to the point it went wrong, although if you'be gone round that many extra buoys I would probably just go for a sail!
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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 11 at 7:19pm
Interesting... I think they have to go back to where they went wrong and if necessary unwind that rounding, but I'd vote that the other marks have no significance. Case 106 says that provided the string goes round the marks the right side it doesn't matter if it also goes round marks the wrong side, and I think that brings us quite close to where we need to be.
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Posts: 1151 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 11 at 8:52pm
Rule 28 doesn't say anything about 'unwinding'.
 
Apply the 'string test' in the rule:  either it works or it doesn't.
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Posts: 1037 		Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 11 at 9:49am
Where things get complicated is when a boat crosses the finishing line, then realise that they have sailed the course incorrectly. If she then goes back and sails the course correctly can the second passage of the finish line be taken as the boat's finish?

I have witnessed some empassioned debates with senior IJs about this one, so youropinion would be interesting.

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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 11 at 3:03pm
Originally posted by gordon

If she then goes back and sails the course correctly can the second passage of the finish line be taken as the boat's finish?

Iff you finish and then strike the finish mark your finish time gets taken when you take the penalty and cross correctly the second time, so I don't see why it should be different if you've missed a mark and go back.
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Posts: 1402 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender 541 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 11 at 3:57pm
You can only get a finish if you have sailed the correct course.  Just because you have crossed the line does not mean you have finished
If you sail the incorrect course on lap 1 and the correct course on lap 2 then all you have done is a very long correction of your error on lap 1.  If the finish also happens to be on lap 2 then congrats, you have just finished having completed 1 lap only
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Posts: 1037 		Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 11 at 6:17pm
Thank you JimC and Contender541....

Now consider the following  :

- rule 28.1 states "She may correct any errors to comply with this rule"

However from the definition:

-  A boat finishes  when any part of her hull, or crew or equipment in normal position, crosses the finishing line in the direction of the course from the last mark, either for the first time or after taking a penalty under rule 4402 or, after correcting an error made at the finishing line, under rule 28.1" (my highlighting)

So according to the definition, unless  an error in sailing the course is made at the finishing line then once you have crossed the line you can return and correct the error.

In the same way, the race committee cannot decide on their own if a boat has sailed the course and so should be considered as finishing. If the RC wishes to penalise the boat, they have to protest. Rule 63.1 is very clear " A boat shall not be penalised without a protest hearing except as provided in rules 30.2, 30.3, 67, A5 and P2." A race committee may only decide that a boat has not finished if the boat fails to cross the finishing line in the direction of the course from the last mark

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Posts: 1037 		Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 11 at 6:19pm
You have all spotted the deliberate error :

So according to the definition, unless an error in sailing the course is made at the finishing line then once you have crossed the line you cannot return and correct the error

Apologies

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The Moo View Drop Down
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Posts: 809 		Post Options Post Options   Quote The Moo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 2:00pm
Originally posted by Contender 541



You can only get a finish if you have sailed the correct course.  Just because you have crossed the line does not mean you have finished
If you sail the incorrect course on lap 1 and the correct course on lap 2 then all you have done is a very long correction of your error on lap 1.  If the finish also happens to be on lap 2 then congrats, you have just finished having completed 1 lap only


Can a competitor or sailing committee arbitarily make that decision? (that no correction is required because the lap didn't count?)
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