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PY changes for 2014
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Rupert View Drop Down
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    Posted: 26 Feb 14 at 10:11pm
Originally posted by yellowwelly

Originally posted by Time Lord

Forget all these artificial, mythical PNs and get yourself into a boat where you can class race at your club.

Boat on boat is much more challenging and exciting than having to sit around after sailing waiting to find out how you have done. I can't think offhand of any other kind of racing that depends on actuarial calculations to decide the result - it almost reduces racing to the level of the judging in synchronised swimming!!

Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap


If not interested in handicap racing, why bother to comment in a thread that holds no interest? Why not go and read the class pages of your favorite class racing boat instead? Those of us who ARE interested, because it is what we do most weekends, aren't really that interested in the standard "go and class race" comments - we have heard them before.
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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Posts: 2003 		Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 14 at 10:18pm
erm, because handicap racing dominates club racing at every other club in my area.... nice to know the whinging, sensitivity and defensiveness of a WI committee meeting still reigns supreme amongst handicap racers. 

Variety on the racecourse can be very good, it's certainly interesting, but at the end of the day, the calculations are nothing but a spreadsheet result... really, it makes no difference to the process.  You know how well you did on the water, and if you couldn't figure that out, then you were in the wrong boat against the rest of your peers, simple.

We had more participation in the handicap racing when the races weren't even timed, never mind the level of micro statical scrutiny they are under these days.... go figure?
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robin34024 View Drop Down
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Posts: 116 		Post Options Post Options   Quote robin34024 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 14 at 10:24pm
Originally posted by Rupert


I guess we are missing the 2 or 3 rock star type helms who are in the Streaker fleet to sell boats, but other than that, standards would be pretty similar from what I've seen. 

And I bet that most of those rock star helms don't club race streakers,  they only seem to set foot in them for the nationals!

From the very limited sailing I've done against the lightnings, before I had a swanky new epoxy streaker might I add, the streaker was simply quicker over the water, and the 1 point handicap difference was obviously nowhere near enough, so its good that the gap has opened up between the two boats  Smile
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andy101 View Drop Down
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Posts: 176 		Post Options Post Options   Quote andy101 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 14 at 10:49pm
Originally posted by andy101

Laser to change by 2 points again........
Which is about half a bad tack and not even enough time to stop concentrating and eat a mars bar for 5 seconds!


I was wrong - One point is barely enough stop fully hiking long enough to lift a cheek & fart!
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Blue One View Drop Down
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Posts: 317 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Blue One Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 12:09am
Originally posted by yellowwelly

Originally posted by Time Lord

Forget all these artificial, mythical PNs and get yourself into a boat where you can class race at your club.

Boat on boat is much more challenging and exciting than having to sit around after sailing waiting to find out how you have done. I can't think offhand of any other kind of racing that depends on actuarial calculations to decide the result - it almost reduces racing to the level of the judging in synchronised swimming!!

Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap

Because for me that would mean changing club and sailing a solo.

Err no. I would rather give up sailing.
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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Posts: 2003 		Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 12:15am
au contraire... maybe the right spirit is one which mixes simiarlish boats on the start line, but then they race scratch.. for a laugh... without all this feeling and emotion that generates 8 pages within 48 hours (and we're not even a pimple on the wider sailing community)  Much as others might deride the vibe of this forum, moaning and whinging about handicaps goes on in every dinghy park and bar across the country, that is something we seem representative of... as Jim said, check out the readers letters from the 80s... I'd venture it's got worse though, not better, even if that seems totally alien and counterintuitive for what seemingly appears 'better statistical work' from the RYA and their voluntary assistance.

Edited by yellowwelly - 27 Feb 14 at 12:17am
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scotsfinn View Drop Down
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Posts: 284 		Post Options Post Options   Quote scotsfinn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 3:06am
I've had it now ... Can't sail one design, can't sail handicap ...... Looks like a year out and time to dust off the bike.  Cry
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getafix View Drop Down
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Posts: 2143 		Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 6:48am
Originally posted by getafix

this forum lacks a "vote here to kill this thread" button


bump
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maxibuddah View Drop Down
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Posts: 1760 		Post Options Post Options   Quote maxibuddah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 7:33am
Everytime the py debate comes up the usual bleat about fleet racing being so great comes up too. Yes we understand that it negates the need to be concerned about the py system. But here's the point, for most of us on here we can't get fleet racing, there isn't any in the class of boat that we like racing.

OK do you understand that, we cannot do fleet racing, therefore py racing is all we have. Let us moan and bitch and do what we want about it and keep your fleet racing comments to yourselves please.
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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Posts: 2003 		Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 7:38am
Originally posted by scotsfinn

I've had it now ... Can't sail one design, can't sail handicap ...... Looks like a year out and time to dust off the bike.  Cry

quite possibly- and once you've joined your mountain bike/time trial/le jog/casual sunday MAMIL club, will someone give you a handicap because you're riding a 1992 Raleigh?  Or will they just welcome you along, give you confidence and inspire you to get better?

I guess that's why cycling is booming, less BS...  whereas dinghy sailing, here at least, has only mustered a marginal increase year on year according to the Watersports Participation Survey for 2013.  Even the report cites the olympic effect and a much nicer summer as the primary contributors.  

Food for thought.... in the UK there has been a 11,000 increase in people claiming to have been involved in dinghy racing, however the top line stats don't look so good, and boat ownership is down:

The proportion of people participating in ‘any boating activity’ more than 6 times has fallen, however, the proportion of people who have participated in ‘any boating activity’ less frequently

has increased

  • –  Increase of 7% points in those participating 2-5 times

  • –  Proportion has stayed constant for participants taking

    part once, although volume has increased greatly on 2012 figures 


    Trends in frequent boating participation

    • The graphs show the volume trends of those people who participate between 6-12 times per year (‘occasionals’) and those who participate over 13 times (‘enthusiasts’)

    • The majority have fallen or stayed at a similar level from 2012 figures. The exception is in manual watersports where the number of those participating 6-12 times has increased

    • Enthusiasts in ‘any boating activity’ are at their lowest level in the study period, this could be due to the increased number of trialists and casual boating participants this year


       
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