RS400 Upgrades

   With the old straight luff main, we used to set the mast up straight in most conditions but mid range, to get the large-ish roach to stand up, we put a tiny amount of inversion in. You couldn't see that if you stood back from the boat but you could sighting up the luff groove with just the jib hoisted and full rig tension. A lot of people were doing this when we all had the old-style main.  I'm not sure with the new main (with more luff curve) that there is any general consensus even now. Some go well with the previous "straight mast" setup. We found it too "stuttery" upwind in a breeze, put in a small amount of pre-bend, put a little more tension in the battens than we had previously to get the leech to stand up and it goes fine now. Needs big mainsheet tension in medium winds but it always did anyhow.

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Oinks Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 24 Oct 14 Location: Bandol Online Status: Offline Posts: 267	Post Options Post Reply Quote Oinks Report Post Quote Reply Topic: RS400 Upgrades Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 12:10am
	With the old straight luff main, we used to set the mast up straight in most conditions but mid range, to get the large-ish roach to stand up, we put a tiny amount of inversion in. You couldn't see that if you stood back from the boat but you could sighting up the luff groove with just the jib hoisted and full rig tension. A lot of people were doing this when we all had the old-style main. I'm not sure with the new main (with more luff curve) that there is any general consensus even now. Some go well with the previous "straight mast" setup. We found it too "stuttery" upwind in a breeze, put in a small amount of pre-bend, put a little more tension in the battens than we had previously to get the leech to stand up and it goes fine now. Needs big mainsheet tension in medium winds but it always did anyhow.

ttc546 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Posting king Joined: 15 Apr 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 155	Post Options Post Reply Quote ttc546 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 10:01am
	I read the very long thread Sam Spoons posted a link to regarding the original proposed changes. - http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7237&PN=1&title=rs400-proposed-changes Lots of discussion on the single line pole and spinnaker hoist proposal. What are peoples experience of doing this conversion since then? Worth it or not? It seems a lot of people still use the separate halyard and pole launch systems. Mine is set like that still. Edited by ttc546 - 31 Mar 17 at 10:01am

Oinks Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 24 Oct 14 Location: Bandol Online Status: Offline Posts: 267	Post Options Post Reply Quote Oinks Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 10:18am
	Nobody I know still uses the single-line hoist. Its been tried a few times on the 4 but there is just too much rope and too much friction.

Sam.Spoons Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3401	Post Options Post Reply Quote Sam.Spoons Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 1:11pm
	Not a 400 but a similar sized boat and rig, the Spice has a single line system and the main issue is friction in the chute mouth when dropping the kite (and to a lesser extent friction retracting the pole). Launching the kite is no problem.
	Spice 346 "Flat Broke" Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"

ttc546 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Posting king Joined: 15 Apr 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 155	Post Options Post Reply Quote ttc546 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 1:18pm
	Yup, I had a brand new Spice many moons ago. Good fun times with that boat.

Sam.Spoons Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3401	Post Options Post Reply Quote Sam.Spoons Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 3:09pm
	Yup, still having fun with mine :)
	Spice 346 "Flat Broke" Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"

laser193713 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 13 May 09 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 889	Post Options Post Reply Quote laser193713 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 4:33pm
	So the boat I have bought doesn't have continuous control lines. I see the done thing is to run the rig tension through a bushing in the thwart, and the cunningham and kicker through 20mm blocks mounted just behind the thwart. Is the rig tension adjuster also continuous normally? Is there a clever way to get 3 lines all to tighten with the same piece of bungee? I'm going to replace the jib sheets, kite sheets and those 3 control lines straight away. Also the kite sheet ratchet blocks. Am I also right in thinking some people put ratchets on the jib sheets? Is this really needed?

RS400atC Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 04 Dec 08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3011	Post Options Post Reply Quote RS400atC Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 5:02pm
	On ours, the rig tension is not continuous. Very rarely touch it afloat. I have separate elastics, they each have a turning block each end of the thwart. the end of each elastic has a thimble on it with the control line running through it. I have two blocks for the control lines hanging from the grab rail, and two close to the cockpit floor. The elastic picks up between these blocks. The block hanging from the grab rail means the kicker can be cleated both sides by pulling the loop from one side. We have jib ratchets, but my crew is not exactly strong in the arm. Some people have been known to use 2:1 jib sheets. I've not seen that for a while though. The load on the jib sheet can be quite high, so if your style dictates having it out of the cleat a lot, you may want a racthet. But it doesn't need the most subtlety, you can usually just pull it in and cleat it, unlike some boats where that would often oversheet it horribly.

andy h Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Groupie Joined: 13 Mar 12 Online Status: Offline Posts: 69	Post Options Post Reply Quote andy h Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 10:35pm
	Despite having been a bit dismissive of tweaks in an earlier post, as a crew these days I'd certainly second the suggestion of nice small auto-ratchet blocks for jibsheets. You definitely want to be playing the jib if you ever have a puffy two sail reach, and even dumping jib power to open up the slot and allow the main to blade out upwind in extreme weather. Having sailed other people's well-sorted 400s for so long I had actually forgotten how many tweaks there potentially are! RS must have incorporated some of them as standard by now.
	Europe AUS53 & FF 3615 National 12 3344, Europe 397 and Mirror 53962 all gone with regret

ClubRacer Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 26 Sep 15 Online Status: Offline Posts: 210	Post Options Post Reply Quote ClubRacer Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 31 Mar 17 at 11:06pm
	In 20+ knots upwind the crew will be playing the jib as hard as the helm plays the main. Without a ratchet you wont be able to let it out in small enough movement to stop it from backing My rule of thumb for ratchets is to always go a block size larger than i would if it wasn't a ratchet. this would be: <6mm rope 30mm block or 40mm ratchet 7-8mm rope 40mm block or 57mm ratchet im currently running 7mm with a 57mm harken auto, as i found even the 8mm was too much friction and 6 is too small on the hands in a blow as for the kite, using 57mm harken autos with 6mm rope for the light stuff and 8mm for the heavy. I've also put a folded over bit of pro-grip on the deck around half way down inline with where the sheets would lay with the sole purpose of stopping them going over the side when not in use someone earlier said about elastic going from shroud fixing point to the toestrap fixing point to tuck ur sheets in to do the same job, I've found putting some 2-3mm string round the toestrap fixing then hooking the elastic onto it means it can double up as a halyard holder to stop them flying away when not in use Edited by ClubRacer - 31 Mar 17 at 11:07pm