New Posts New Posts RSS Feed: Raising rudder
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Raising rudder

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <123>
Author
Brass View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 24 Mar 08
Location: Australia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1151
Post Options Post Options   Quote Brass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Raising rudder
    Posted: 29 Apr 11 at 12:20am
Originally posted by Rupert

Interesting about the Laser - all ours sail with them up in light winds, I think, and the lake is mainly more than 1.5m. How does one go about stopping the practice without resorting to protest
Why would you not want to 'resort' to a protest?  Protesting is part of the game.  If you think another boat has broken a rule and you want that boat penalised, you SHOULD protest.
 
OK, so you don't want to be seen to 'ambushing' other competitors with a little-known rule.  Here are some things you can do:
 
  1. contact your Sailing Committee, draw their attention to the rule and the fact that competitors in the club are breaking it frequently, and suggest that they advise competitors of the existence and application of the rule, and perhaps that they undertake to protest boats that break the rule.
  2. When you have seen a boat break the rule, politely go up to them and tell them about the rule and that they have broken it.  You can also tell them that if you see them break the rule another time you will protest them.
  3. If you are completely spineless, pin a copy of the rule on the sailing noticeboard, and futilely hope that this fixes the problem.
Back to Top
Rupert View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 11 Aug 04
Location: Whitefriars sc
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 8956
Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 11 at 10:37am
Quite right about the Firefly, and I always keep mine down. Mind, when the wind gets light I can switch to an old style spoon rudder, which is "up" anyway!

Interesting about the Laser - all ours sail with them up in light winds, I think, and the lake is mainly more than 1.5m. How does one go about stopping the practice without resorting to protest?

Some classes (British Moth springs to mind) have very few rules on rudder shape, so I assume lifting the blade isn't a problem.
Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
Back to Top
Andymac View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 04 Apr 07
Location: Derbyshire
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 852
Post Options Post Options   Quote Andymac Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 11 at 8:28pm
Originally posted by fudheid

[QUOTE=Lukepiewalker](j) The rudder shall be maintained in the full down
position except whilst racing in water less than
1.5m deep unless otherwise specified in the sailing

instructions.


I take it back...

Where's it say that in the RRS?
Apparently a local RYA P.O.R. said that there has been protests upheld and it is not allowed to adjust rudder when racing. Unless it is designed to do so like a foil.......
Just can't find the rule
 
 
Lukepiewalker was quoting LASER class rules not the RRS'.
 
Here is a class rule from the FIREFLY which could prohibit the action described in the opening post;

FIREFLY class sailing rule 11, d) (iii) The blade of a lifting rudder shall not be raised intentionally or be allowed to

remain raised, whilst racing. A boat that gains tactical advantages through

raising the rudder (albeit temporarily and/or accidentally) is liable to

disqualification.

 
Back to Top
JimC View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 17 May 04
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6661
Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 11 at 10:37am
Originally posted by GybeFunny

No part of the helmsman or crew may be placed forward of the mast while racing.What is the point of that rule

Would have thought the point was obvious. Its to stop you having to crawl in front of the mast to be competitive in the light stuff. If you did have to sail the boat in that awkward manner how many people at inland clubs would say "stuff that" and go and buy a Solo?
Back to Top
GybeFunny View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work


Joined: 27 Oct 09
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 403
Post Options Post Options   Quote GybeFunny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 11 at 8:23am
Originally posted by Contender443

OK so we have done the Laser, what about any other classes?
 
Also are there any other "odd" class specific rules that you may not know about. For example I think the RS200 does not allow goosewinging the kite.


Thats not quite true, the class rules seem to say you can boom out the kite to windward but cant hold it with your arm. The circuit SIs tend to say you cant goosewing at all but that just applies at circuit events.

< ="text/">#toc, .toc, .mw-warning { border: 1px solid rgb(170, 170, 170); background-color: rgb(249, 249, 249); padding: 5px; font-size: 95%; }#toc h2, .toc h2 { display: inline; border: medium none; padding: 0pt; font-size: 100%; font-weight: bold; }#toc #toctitle, .toc #toctitle, #toc .toctitle, .toc .toctitle { text-align: center; }#toc ul, .toc ul { list-style-type: none; list-style-image: none; margin-left: 0pt; padding-left: 0pt; text-align: left; }#toc ul ul, .toc ul ul { margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 2em; }#toc .toctoggle, .toc .toctoggle { font-size: 94%; }body { text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0in; text-align: left; font-weight: normal; font-variant: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; widows: 2; font-family: 'Times New Roman'; }table { }td { border-collapse: collapse; text-align: left; vertical-align: top; }

 The clew of the spinnaker or jib may only be boomed-out to set on the opposite side to the mainsail.  This rule can be changed by event Sailing Instructions.


Back to Top
GybeFunny View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work


Joined: 27 Oct 09
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 403
Post Options Post Options   Quote GybeFunny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 11 at 8:17am
Originally posted by tomoore1

What if you have a load of weed on the rudder, could you raise and lower it to clear it?


In a laser a couple of roll tacks will clear the rudder of allbut the most stubborn weed.

There is a silly thing in the laser rules that states:

No part of the helmsman or crew may be placed forward of the mast while racing.

What is the point of that rule?
Back to Top
tomoore1 View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: 03 Jun 08
Location: Wales
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 99
Post Options Post Options   Quote tomoore1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 11 at 8:24pm
What if you have a load of weed on the rudder, could you raise and lower it to clear it?
Restoring Firefly 517
Back to Top
Contender443 View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 01 Oct 04
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1211
Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender443 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 11 at 5:54pm
OK so we have done the Laser, what about any other classes?
 
Also are there any other "odd" class specific rules that you may not know about. For example I think the RS200 does not allow goosewinging the kite.
Bonnie Lass Contender 1764
Back to Top
JimC View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 17 May 04
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6661
Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 11 at 4:26pm
Originally posted by fudheid

Apparently a local RYA P.O.R. said that there has been protests upheld and it is not allowed to adjust rudder when racing

Think there may have been a bit of Chinese whispering going on... Lifting the rudder so as to better paddle with it, for instance, to scull with the rudder on the startline is prohibited under propulsion rules. Lifting the rudder to clear sandbanks is fine under RRS.

Then anything that is in the class rules of any particular class always applies to that class, even in handicap racing, because RRS says you must obey class rules. So in this case the Laser rules say you can only lift the rudder in shallow water.
Back to Top
fudheid View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work
Avatar

Joined: 21 Apr 11
Location: 51.53 N 01.28 E
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 241
Post Options Post Options   Quote fudheid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 11 at 4:09pm
[QUOTE=olly_love]im guessing your racing at felixstowe,
i used to raise my foils and sail over the bar, its just a good tactic, and nothing in the club rules says you cant, normally they make you go around the green and red markers to stop you going through the cut
well the club rule race under the isaf rules........also having raced at felixstowe they don't always put the bar buoys in - makes it interesting when you have a choice of entrys (fnarr Wink)
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <123>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.665y
Copyright ©2001-2010 Web Wiz
Change your personal settings, or read our privacy policy