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    Posted: 21 Feb 05 at 11:09am

There are two threads running on this see the other ...

http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4 66&PN=1

Perhaps we could get these threads merged ... moderator please ...
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Posts: 1599 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 05 at 8:29am

There is an interesting story on this on The Daily Sail with long quotes from both Barker and Bell, the chairman of the jury. Since it is a subscription site, I suppose I had better not quote verbatim. 

Bell says Barker needed to push Irwin/Perry down to 26th to benefit and would have needed to slow them by 8 minutes to do so. Their tactics slowed them by 3 minutes and there was no chance they could have slowed them by 8. Therefore it was team racing.

Barker says they pushed Irwin/Perry to the left hand of the course, which along with most of the fleet they expected to be non-favoured. As it turned out, it was the way to go. If the shift had not favoured the left hand side, they say they might have got them to 26th and gained 2nd place in the series for themselves.

I think Barker makes a more plausible case that is was not team racing than the protest report gives them credit for. However if team racing tactics became common in fleet racing, it would ruin the sport. Therefore I think that given that GBR1516's tactics were, at best, open to question, the jury did the right thing.

 
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Posts: 779 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Blobby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 05 at 12:14am

In which case are you saying they are guilty of nothing but failing to sail the aussies far enough down the fleet to be of benefit to themselves??

Either way it appears clear that they tried to operate as a team and the rules have been successfully applied to demonstrate that this behaviour is unacceptable.  End of Story.
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Posts: 2415 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Scooby_simon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 05 at 8:01pm

So if only one discard, could it be seen that GBR1516 could have gone up the leader board if they had forced AUS631 bleow 28th ?

I have a feeling this one will run and run till we can get some first hand accounts......
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Posts: 1599 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 05 at 4:55pm

Originally posted by Ralph T

What price the RYA Charter when the pressures of performance to gain sponsorship and RYA funding require our top sailors to resort to such depths

It does seem as though something like the "professional foul" has come to a major sailing event, and that if the need to show a return on their sponsor's money hadn't been involved,  the incident may not have happened.

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Posts: 36 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Ralph T Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 05 at 4:23pm

If you have not read the links please do, the reports are so enlightening!

What price the RYA Charter when the pressures of performance to gain sponsorship and RYA funding require our top sailors to resort to such depths

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Posts: 1599 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 05 at 3:45pm

Originally posted by Scooby_simon

was the series 7 races, discard 2 ? (or discard 1)

Discard 1 by the look of it. The way I read it, that is implicit in the protest committee's report. Also the NOR http://www.takapunaboating.org.nz/SMLogo/Int%2014%20NoR.doc doesn't say anything special about discard, and the default arrangement in RRS Appendix A is one discard. The SIs don't seem to be on the website.

Personally I think GBR1516 was lucky to avoid a rule 69 protest. 
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Posts: 1105 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Phil eltringham Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 05 at 3:12pm
By the looks of it i think the RMW boys could have been a bit more subtle about it.  Simply follow the aussies round the whole course slowing them a little at a time instead of doing it all in one hit at the end, where their influence could easilly be quantified.  Harder to do, but 'safer' from their point of view. 
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Posts: 2415 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Scooby_simon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 05 at 3:09pm

was the series 7 races, discard 2 ? (or discard 1)

If discard only one then does this not apply :

As AUS631 is discarding a 27, if they could be sailed down to 29th they would need to count it and then be down the pan ?

 

And if so was not GBR1516 valid in trying this (all-be-it too late as it was probably (rightly?) seen as an attempt to help GBR1513).

Any one know how many discards were available ?  

Sure I am missing something here ?

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Posts: 36 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Ralph T Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 05 at 1:34pm

Can't believe that anyone could disagree with the Protest Committee. Pretty obvious what was happeneing when Alistair 'sailed back' from 150 mtres ahead

Thought it might have been rule 2 & good to see that it is being implemented

Thanks for the info Harry
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