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combat wombat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote combat wombat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: New boat choice
    Posted: 28 Nov 06 at 9:05pm
Originally posted by Isis

Originally posted by les5269

Originally posted by combat wombat

In the B14, the crew makes a huge difference to speed and the team work is hugely rewarding.  I reckon there isn't another boat where the crew can make such a difference (bar the 18ft Skiff). 

 ummm 49er?

not going very quick if the crew lets the main go   



Id say most of the skiff type boats the crew plays a very big roll... especialy where they take the main which I didnt think they did on the b14?


True, all Skiff boats need a good crew but the B14 has more jobs for them.  49er has a self tacker and a nice chute for the kite.  The B14 requires more work from the crew (ie kite drops are crucial and can win or lose races).  It may not be as hard to sail as the 49er but the team work is more crucial.

On the mainsheet, its personal preference.  On our boat the helm takes the main and I play the jib (as it is crucial for boatspeed in a blow), but you can sail the other way if the jib sheets are long enough. 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote CurlyBen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 06 at 9:30pm
Laser 5000 has a bagged kite and no self tacker! And all this trapeze business as well. I really noticed going back to the 5k from an 800 how much more difference the crew makes.
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combat wombat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote combat wombat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 06 at 9:48pm
Ok, forgot about the 5k... fair call!
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les5269 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote les5269 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 06 at 9:55pm

I sailed the 5000 for 8 years and I reckon the 49er gives both crew much more to do.

The self tacking jib is sorted by the helm in the 49er,the kite does go into a chute but is a lot bigger than the 5000 (and I thought the bag was easier in some respects!)

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Post Options Post Options   Quote oldbloke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 06 at 12:14pm

 It seems to me that the big problem is that there isnt any decent racing and especially high performance dinghy racing in the Plymouth area. Lots of yachting, lots of clubs but no decent fleets.

If RodB wants to sail a skiff in something like a fleet he will probably have to go to Starcross where there is limited water, lots of sandbanks but also a number of B14s that turnout and sail regularly.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote 49erGBR735HSC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 06 at 1:11pm
Originally posted by oldbloke

 It seems to me that the big problem is that there isnt any decent racing and especially high performance dinghy racing in the Plymouth area. Lots of yachting, lots of clubs but no decent fleets.

If RodB wants to sail a skiff in something like a fleet he will probably have to go to Starcross where there is limited water, lots of sandbanks but also a number of B14s that turnout and sail regularly.

 

As you say, High performance dinghy racing in the Plymouth area is very restricted. There are enough boats at the clubs to generate the numbers for an assymetric fleet at a club like the Mayflower, however, its very rare to see many High Performance boats out on the water at the same time. We know of the active boats but from the top of my head, I can only think of about 6 different High Performance boats at Mount Batten which have been on the water at the same time as us, which is quite poor considering the Mount Batten dinghy park had a waiting list for spaces. We try and sail on a regular basis, at least once a week during term time, but with coursework piling up, haven't had as much time to recently.From our point of view, we really want to be racing down in Plymouth but if there is no club organising it and boats are just sitting in dinghy parks, it's a bit of an uphill struggle. We can't speak to owners of High Performance boats we've never met, so trying to organise racing is really hard, and as such we're trying to persuade students into certain classes to build a fleet then approach a sailing club to propose giving us a fleet start and a windward/leeward course.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote b14er Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 06 at 2:40pm
Hi

I am one of the Starcross B14 sailors.  We now have six B14s and a couple of Mustoskiffs who race regularly.   We race at high tide and the sand banks are rarely a problem once you know where they are.

As someone the wrong side of 50 I find the B14 one of the more comfortable boats I have ever sailed (49er, 505, RS499, Solo, Lark, Laser, Enterprise etc.) - it is definitely a boat that rewards finesse rather than brute force.  The rig  supports a competitive weight range from 21 - 26 stone, and I have sailed my boat with my daughter (9) and father (75+) in moderate weather.  Like all skiff-like boats it gets interesting when you hit the racks which happens in winds of about 8 knots . . . and to be honest I don't take racing too seriously in winds below that. Above 12 knots it becomes serious fun - I have been sailing it for 6 years now and still enjoy it immensely

If you get a B14 you would be welcome to join us - PM me and I'll fix up a trial sail if you want.


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Post Options Post Options   Quote b14er Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 06 at 2:45pm
. . .  regarding crew workload - I find it better for the helm than the 49er where there was not enough to do and the guy at the back could get cold!.  Agility and balance is more important than strength for the crew.  The crew has an enormous impact on boatspeed upwind (playing the jib in gusts) and downwind (preventing the 29sq m kite throwing you in the p*ss).

The spinnaker bag issue is a real red herring - once you have perfected the techniques it isn't any harder than a chute drop (though a few seconds slower) - but the spinnakers last a LOT longer in competitive condition.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote redback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 06 at 10:52pm

I'd say you've got to get racing.  I also think high performance boats are poor performance boats at 10K and less - its only the racing that makes them interesting.  A 4000 is an easy boat to sail in light to medium winds when you don't have all the other considerations of racing.  In fact I've met many people who claim to have mastered 4000s and 800s when on holiday in Majorca or similar and then make a real pigs ear when racing.

You are never going to find a boat which is exciting to sail in 10K or less and in many ways the high performance boats are optimised for high speed which they are not going to reach at that wind speed.  In fact some high performance boats are dogs in light winds.  Racing is what adds the edge.

However if you are going to go out in 25K or more the 4000 is the boat unless you are an aspiring olympian and funnily enough the 4000 is probably the best of all those mentioned in the sub 10K speed also.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote wetandwindy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 06 at 11:32pm
Have you considered the 59er? It creams along in light wind and should give 800s and B14s a run for their money speed wise. It's a lot lighter than the 4000 and is very comfortable to hike from so should be easy on the knees.
RULE 99.9 section A: Fast boats with big spinnakers have right of way.
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