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New Rule 87 |
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scrimbosdad 
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Joined: 27 Jun 08 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2 |
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 Topic: New Rule 87Posted: 26 Nov 08 at 12:03pm |
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At our club we want to encourage youth sailors to participate in club racing, and we allow the use of pattern sails for our club Toppers and Lasers. In line with Appendix J2.2 (7) of RRS 2005-20008 we included in our SI (for club racing only, not Open Meetings) specific permission for these to be used. With the new rule 87 it seems we can no longer include this in our SI unless we display specific permission from that Class Association. Have other clubs come across this problem, and do they have a solution?
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fizgig
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alstorer
Really should get out more 
Joined: 02 Aug 07 Location: Cambridge Online Status: Offline Posts: 2899 |
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Posted: 26 Nov 08 at 12:53pm |
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I would have thought that unless you specifically say otherwise, your racing (assuming handicap here) is not raced under class rules as such, and therefore whilst you might have to word your rules more carefully (to stop "illeagal" modified boats being used without permission) then you should be OK. Do you make sure any weight-equalised classes stick to their rules? |
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Fraggle
Far too distracted from work 
Joined: 28 Feb 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 220 |
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Posted: 26 Nov 08 at 2:30pm |
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I use a practice sail in club racing (as do lots of members at my club) and I am fairly certain there is nothing in the club SI's about this. In club racing you are not racing under class rules so shouldn't be a problem.
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radixon
Really should get out more
Joined: 27 Oct 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2407 |
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Posted: 26 Nov 08 at 3:55pm |
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Unless you have a die hard sailor who insists on laying down the rules, then I don;t think this will be a problem. I personally think its a disadvantage but at least they are making the effort to get out on the water. If they win, well done to them. I am sure you can put a clause in the Sailing Instructions for that,. |
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Guest
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Joined: 21 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 0 |
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Posted: 26 Nov 08 at 4:15pm |
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I believe class rules apply under the racing rules of sailing. That is a good spot - will the UKLA give clubs permission to use replica Laser sails? |
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Guests
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Posted: 26 Nov 08 at 4:22pm |
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Personally, I think taking weight out of a weight-equalised boat (even for handicap racing) is grossly unsporting and a definte breach of the rules, unless the race officer is informed and the py corrected accordingly. |
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NeilP
Far too distracted from work
Joined: 23 Nov 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 271 |
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Posted: 26 Nov 08 at 5:39pm |
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I would have thought that by entering a handicap event and accepting the PN the organising body gives your class of boat, you are by implication committed to abiding by the class rules, certainly as far as measurement and equipment goes. Otherwise, what's to stop someone racing, say, a Merlin with all the lead taken out and a 470 kite? So technically, I guess a Laser with a training sail isn't a Laser, so you're open to protest. Having said that, why can't you run Lasers as two separate classes, with and without genuine sails, give them the same start and amalgamate the series results? Should remove the opportunity for protests. What do you all think? |
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No FD? No Comment!
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gordon
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Joined: 07 Sep 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1037 |
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Posted: 26 Nov 08 at 10:14pm |
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I would suggest that non class compliant boats may compete for club handicap trophies (perhaps with a small handicap penalty) but not for th club class prizes.
Gordon |
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Gordon
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Chew my RS
Really should get out more
Joined: 05 Oct 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 790 |
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Posted: 27 Nov 08 at 9:00am |
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But what handicap do you give a non-compliant boat? A non-compliant Merlin Rocket could be 20-30kg under weight. Is it perhaps any wonder Merlins seem to be handicap bandits if they are still allowed to sail to 1023 depite only weighing 70kg.
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http://www.sailns14.org - The ultimate family raceboat now available in the UK
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Guest
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Joined: 21 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 0 |
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Posted: 27 Nov 08 at 9:06am |
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I suspect it is highly unlikley that any Merlins remove their lead for club racing. I would think the main issues are: - Use of replica sails The latter of these should be easy to see but of course you don't know how heavy the crew are, that said I don't believe any of the weight equalised classes to be bandits. What interests me is that the rule really protects the commercial interests of the likes of Laser and Topper as I am sure there respective class assocations will not give clubs permission to use replica sails. |
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