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Posts: 267 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Oinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: RYA Wokebomb
    Posted: 29 Mar 21 at 3:41pm
A good few years back, a few of us sat outside having a beer after racing, and 2 black fellas rock up and start rigging a Fireball. They seemed to know what they were doing and gave us a friendly wave which we reciprocated. So late afternoon on a sunny Sunday, F4-5, they launched, and sailed around for an hour or so, falling in, blasting and having a fine old time. We could hear the laughter from the shore. They came and had a beer with us after and we had a good old laugh with them. Shame was we never saw them again!
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Posts: 1312 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Do Different Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 21 at 3:14pm
I wasn't saying tribalism is a good thing, simply a reality which has to be acknowledged and overcome.

I agree with you iGRF, I've heard proper horror stories from our WS'ers about getting changed in car at a far corner. We've have plenty of WS'ers  and when I was Committee & Comm. I refused to get into labels; we all paid the same fees and had equal opportunities.  We have several members who both WS and DS, some even SUP.

"maybe we should have considered encouraging more ethnic riders, oh wait, we had loads, we just didn't notice."    Exactly! the (as it feels to me) current fixation of society on labels seems to do harm and cause division. 

"What do you identify as?"   Who cares, just get on and stop flag waving.
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Posts: 6499 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 21 at 2:58pm
Originally posted by Do Different

]It is an anthropological reality that we are all programmed to be tribal.


Hence the resistance to windsurfers having a Yardstick?

Not very inclusive, the RYA, took years for us to even be allowed to sail at some clubs and even now i bet we're still banned on certain days at certain clubs,(Bewl) maybe we should have considered encouraging more ethnic riders, oh wait, we had loads, we just didn't notice.
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Do Different View Drop Down
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Posts: 1312 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Do Different Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 21 at 11:57am
The thing that some people fail to acknowledge is that the whole inclusion issue is a two way street. 

It is an anthropological reality that we are all programmed to be tribal. All perceptions from every group are clouded by a tribal view. I suggest that there is a majority in the non white/male/middle class/ tribe who view the sailing tribe as one they absolutely have no interest in joining.

Obviously I'm struggling to name an example because being a white country dweller I know little of other ethnic groups.  I don't know, say, are Reggae clubs wringing hands because they attract very few white teenagers?
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Posts: 360 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sussex Lad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 21 at 10:24am
Originally posted by maxibuddah

Elitism - there are two parts, the one in the sport and the perception the public has of the sport. The former is the squads, olympics, etc, which probably only affects those within the sport. Those outside of it won't even know about it and it doesn't affect why or why not they won't engage with the sport.

The latter is the one that is part of the barriers to people coming into the sport. As said previous the RYA's actual title doesn't help - Royal and Yachting. Two things that scream elitism unfortunately. People think of yachts as big boats for the rich and wealthy. That will put them off straightaway. 

Further to that is the perceived cost. You need a boat, all the gear, etc, etc, etc. This is expensive. You may not think so but to a hefty portion of the country it really is. 

Everyone says their club is friendly and welcoming, but it is? Think of being a new person to the sport, coming through a gate, often large and protected by barbed wire to deter thieves, to somewhere down a dark lane to find someone who may or may not say hello. Intimidating to a lot. Just getting them through the gate to meet someone is difficult enough. But that is just one of the challenges, but one of the most important, at least if they are there you can talk to them and make them welcome. At the moment you feel like you must have to make an appointment, no just walking in off the street. Another barrier.

The only way the sport can prosper is to bring new people into it as there is always a turnover. Our club is concentrating on training and working at trying to retain the kids that come and those adults too. It is fairly successful but it does fall on a team of volunteers that must be at their limit of what they can do. I don't know how you can overcome that issue. But yes introducing youths and middle-aged is possibly the only way to keep going.





Yes. 

The main obstacle in overcoming this problem is that most sailors don't or won't understand the notion that other peoples perceptions are totally different to theirs. They don't understand why anyone would have a different perspective.

Several years ago I asked my wife "why aren't there more women in politics?" she replied "because we have better and more important things to do". Needless to say I now understand her perspective a little better.
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Posts: 1760 		Post Options Post Options   Quote maxibuddah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 21 at 9:18am
Originally posted by 423zero

People can approach on the lakeside, not very good security to encourage people to just walk in boat park and club house, members wallets and such are just hanging up in the changing rooms.

Provide lockers and the like or encourage people to lock their valuables in their cars. Or have keypads on changing room doors. Leaving stuff in a changing room is asking for trouble unfortunately. 

If we want people to join in we need to make the approach to clubs easier. People are reluctant to join in if there are any barriers to do so. Its far easier to make an excuse not to do something than to do it. 

Perhaps we need to get the RYA to start advertising family friendly things in non sailing places more. I don't know what they do currently as things like facebook algorithms are skewed to the individual so I see them regularly but thats cos I follow a lot of sailing stuff on there. I'm they must do something. Retro is in, so why not go for the swallow/amazons route with a modern twist? 
Everything I say is my opinion, honest
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Posts: 3420 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 21 at 9:07am
People can approach on the lakeside, not very good security to encourage people to just walk in boat park and club house, members wallets and such are just hanging up in the changing rooms.
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Posts: 1760 		Post Options Post Options   Quote maxibuddah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 21 at 8:44am
Elitism - there are two parts, the one in the sport and the perception the public has of the sport. The former is the squads, olympics, etc, which probably only affects those within the sport. Those outside of it won't even know about it and it doesn't affect why or why not they won't engage with the sport.

The latter is the one that is part of the barriers to people coming into the sport. As said previous the RYA's actual title doesn't help - Royal and Yachting. Two things that scream elitism unfortunately. People think of yachts as big boats for the rich and wealthy. That will put them off straightaway. 

Further to that is the perceived cost. You need a boat, all the gear, etc, etc, etc. This is expensive. You may not think so but to a hefty portion of the country it really is. 

Everyone says their club is friendly and welcoming, but it is? Think of being a new person to the sport, coming through a gate, often large and protected by barbed wire to deter thieves, to somewhere down a dark lane to find someone who may or may not say hello. Intimidating to a lot. Just getting them through the gate to meet someone is difficult enough. But that is just one of the challenges, but one of the most important, at least if they are there you can talk to them and make them welcome. At the moment you feel like you must have to make an appointment, no just walking in off the street. Another barrier.

The only way the sport can prosper is to bring new people into it as there is always a turnover. Our club is concentrating on training and working at trying to retain the kids that come and those adults too. It is fairly successful but it does fall on a team of volunteers that must be at their limit of what they can do. I don't know how you can overcome that issue. But yes introducing youths and middle-aged is possibly the only way to keep going.
Everything I say is my opinion, honest
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Posts: 929 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Paramedic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Mar 21 at 7:15pm
I hadn't actually thought of this, but I wonder how diverse the RYA squads actually are? I would be surprised if our Y&J system at the club doesn't knock spots off it.
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Posts: 60 		Post Options Post Options   Quote moomin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Mar 21 at 7:00pm
IMO, there is a hint of buck passing by the RYA here, most sailing clubs are not elitist and will welcome any new members from any background at reasonable fees, club boats and help finding cheap second hand or crewing opportunities. The problem comes in the next stage, if you want to progress up the squads, get noticed by the RYA, then either on the elite system or into coaching you need financial backing. Travelling the country to events, staying in hotels, buying better quality kit, that's where the elitism comes in, and you need to do all that before getting close to any elite squad funding. This results in a lack of diversity in the RYA, and no role models.
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