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Boats for sale
| Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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| Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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List classes of boat for sale |
Ovington Laser |
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Cirrus 
Really should get out more 
Joined: 29 Oct 15 Location: UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 590 |
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 Topic: Ovington LaserPosted: 04 Oct 20 at 10:09pm |
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As below ..
Edited by Cirrus - 04 Oct 20 at 10:14pm |
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Cirrus
Really should get out more
Joined: 29 Oct 15 Location: UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 590 |
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Posted: 04 Oct 20 at 10:13pm |
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... think it comes down to the old adage being selected as an Olympic class is a blessing and a curse.
Shall we take that as more 'curse' than 'blessing' in reality ? .. rather it looks very much like the 'old guard' fighting over something that the rest of the world has quietly moved beyond now and cares even less about. The original Laser concept, drive and ideals abandoned long long ago, seemingly by all parties involved. There are few rich pickings or glory left for anyone now and certainly not enough to do more than delay further decline.
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Grumpycat
Far too distracted from work 
Joined: 29 Sep 20 Online Status: Offline Posts: 497 |
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Posted: 04 Oct 20 at 10:36pm |
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But it’s never as simple as that . Why to people pay more for a golf than a seat. Because residuals are higher. People will pay more because of this . Because you can sail a ILCA in more places and more events than you can sail LPE boat .
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423zero
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Joined: 08 Jan 15 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3420 |
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Posted: 05 Oct 20 at 6:12am |
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Depends on who has the deepest pockets and the nerve to take it to the wire, wouldn't take a lot of money to set up a series, plus you have the big opens, when they restart. Aero going to be more affected by ILCA than Laser.
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Robert
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Paramedic
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Joined: 27 Jan 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 929 |
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Posted: 05 Oct 20 at 8:22am |
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The deck is foam sandwich and always has been. Ovi are probably working to tighter tolerances = increased labour time. And they have new tooling/protoyping to pay for. With the situation regarding rival classes they probably want to recoup these costs and hopefully earn some money out of the class before the end of the current Olympic class cycle. I agree they seem expensive, and I agree that the LPE product must be a concern (And they no longer have a reason to work to tight tolerances and dont have tooling costs to recoup). But I can see why they might choose to pitch at the price level they've chosen. They people who want the boat the most and are most likely to buy are already locked into the system and have little choice - thats how it is with s SMOD.
Edited by Paramedic - 05 Oct 20 at 8:30am |
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Late starter
Far too distracted from work
Joined: 24 Feb 07 Online Status: Offline Posts: 481 |
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Posted: 05 Oct 20 at 8:35am |
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I think that's probably true at first, as "official" ILCA's with their price premium are going to be mandatory for serious class/nats/Olympic etc level racing and guys sailing at this level are the sort of folk who will buy new boats. But how many grassroots sailors are going to spend £6.5k on a new ILCA or even £4-5k for a second hand one to sail at club level ? I think the ILCA is likely to depreciate badly in the long term due to brand confusion and price competion from LPE. I just don't think there are enough "serious" ILCA/Laser sailors who will need an "official" boat compared to the mass of club level/recreational sailors who LPE will target. But hey, I don't sail Lasers any more so I could be wrong !
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Cirrus
Really should get out more
Joined: 29 Oct 15 Location: UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 590 |
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Posted: 05 Oct 20 at 8:50am |
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There is little parallel here between a 'Golf' and a 'Seat' at all - and as most know they are both VW group anyway along with the Skoda versions. Even in your example if the price difference was 40%+ 'Golf' sales would plumet .. but VW group would still make a good crust. To me it is looking increasingly like a group of rival manufacturers arguing about the rights and technical issues associated with 'Betamax' or 'VHS' products.... when the 'ship' was starting to go down and when residial demand is sliding away. The world has moved on and that is that. The Laser/ICLA products are well into 'cash-cow' territory and have been for years - ie milk the product for cash, and as much as possible of that too - for here there will be no further growth or likely market penetration !!.... and 'rivals' with a virtually identical product and a real grudge to boot. On top of that ICLA and their new friends have more to fear from the technical upstarts like the Aero, and far eastern 'me-too' future rivals in market areas that could still take to sailing big time, than any rump of historical Laser bulders. The only part of the game for ILCA remaining is the '5 circus ring' endorsement surely - but would anybody really want their future sales hanging by that thin thread - so easily cut ? Take that away and all that will be left is the 'generic' version buyers (cos the 'purists' will have transferred their loyalties to the next 'Olympic' class or its feeders). The generic builder of the 'Laser' conversally might well still persist, even then, if it keeps to a very tight price related strategy.. They would build where they do today at first but then look to far eastern partnerships and production in the longer term. In summary the ILCA concept faces two major threats 1) 'Better' more technically advanced alternatives - some even already built by their new builder friends 2) Lower cost rivals with almost identical 'Laser' products ... Threats from both directions. What a place to end up .... not
 Edited by Cirrus - 05 Oct 20 at 8:55am |
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davidyacht
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Joined: 29 Mar 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1345 |
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Posted: 05 Oct 20 at 11:15am |
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There could almost be a need for a third Laser/ILCA Association or maybe LICALaser that administers a levelish equipment playing field at club level ... the LPE product is at a great price to grow the sport at grassroots level, but problems need some rules to control an arms race in knock off sails and equipment
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Happily living in the past
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jeffers
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Joined: 29 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3048 |
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Posted: 05 Oct 20 at 12:23pm |
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We have noticed a definite step in speed for people who use Mk2 sails over Mk1s (even a new Mk1). Carbon top sections are another matter, we only have a couple of people who have only just started using them so time will tell.
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Paul
---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
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rich96
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Joined: 20 Jan 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 596 |
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Posted: 05 Oct 20 at 12:47pm |
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Word is that the carbon top section allied with a mark 2 sail is more powerful and has pushed the ideal helm weight up a few KG from what was 78-80kg ?
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