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Is sailing too complex |
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423zero 
Really should get out more 
Joined: 08 Jan 15 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3420 |
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 Topic: Is sailing too complexPosted: 25 Jan 20 at 10:27am |
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Mirror in single hander mode.
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Robert
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ian.r.mcdonald
Far too distracted from work 
Joined: 24 Feb 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 440 |
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Posted: 25 Jan 20 at 10:30am |
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Learning to sail,buying the boat,joining a club and then arranging to be involved in events and taking part is complex.
How complicated the boat is a tiny part of the process, and will have a tiny part of the success ( or not) of the class. Scows? Cheap, lots of variation so you can hide behind the differences if you wish, a blend of racers,diy experts etc. etc and I suspect a lack of the people best at holding a class back- those taking it too seriously |
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Riv
Far too distracted from work
Joined: 23 Nov 13 Location: South Devon Online Status: Offline Posts: 353 |
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Posted: 25 Jan 20 at 6:49pm |
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I think Bethwaite said that the best boat was a wing in the air, a low drag floaty bit and a wing in the water. (correct me if I'm wrong and I can't remember the reference). So Sailing is a mixture of flying; complicated and very very expensive and floating. Less so. There is therefore a built in anount of complexity and cost that is difficult to get around. Windsurfers/sailboards get around some of the physical complexity by using the sailors body as part of the structure but this means a higher level of skill and fitness. I agree with IRM above that the complex bit that gets a lot of people is the aspect of joining learning and being involved. The complexity of the hardware is a relatively minor matter. |
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Mistral Div II prototype board, Original Windsurfer, Hornet built'74.
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423zero
Really should get out more
Joined: 08 Jan 15 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3420 |
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Posted: 26 Jan 20 at 1:36pm |
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My journey into sailing began with a friends suggestion, his step father ran a RYA training centre.
I booked level 1, turned up to somewhere full of strangers, no gear, no idea, within 30 minutes I was drinking tea and given sailing gear to wear, brilliant morning, never forgotten friends I made there, 4 weekends later passed level 1. Booked level 2, 4 weekends later passed level 2, instructors advice was, join a club if I wanted to progress, phoned my local club, arranged to turn up following saturday, again turned up at a place full of strangers, 10 years later made loads of friends, know how to run races, etc. My experience of sailing is, there are no strangers only friends we haven't yet met, complex sport made easier by dedicated participants.
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Robert
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CapSizer
Newbie 
Joined: 29 Dec 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 18 |
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Posted: 27 Jan 20 at 5:53am |
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I'm falling into the very bad habit of starting sentences with "My father used to say", and I'm going to do it again now! One of the things he used to say was "It's very easy to learn to sail, but very difficult to learn to sail very well." He never did learn to sail well ... So here is the opinion that I'm forming. In the heyday of dinghy sailing there were no intimidating structured multi-level courses. Somebody quickly "showed you the ropes", plonked you in an Oppie, Mirror or Enterprise, and pushed you out to go and learn by yourself. And the sport thrived. Aren't we now frightening people off by insisting that it is so complex and difficult that you need this advanced structured course to even start? And that sailing is really about 30 knot foilers, rather than something you can feel comfortable with?
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tink
Really should get out more
Joined: 23 Jan 16 Location: North Hants Online Status: Offline Posts: 789 |
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Posted: 27 Jan 20 at 7:00am |
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Absolutely spot on, managed to sail for near 40 years before I had any sailing qualifications. I would say now that there are fewer individuals that sail boats that are ‘push you out and learn by yourself’ boats’, don’t think Laser, Aero or RS400 would get many people out a second time. The clubs have plenty but our newbie need a Level 2 to borrow one of those.
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Tink
https://tinkboats.com http://proasail.blogspot.com |
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JimC
Really should get out more
Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662 |
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Posted: 27 Jan 20 at 9:00am |
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And few people learned to sail well. The problem with being shoved out in a boat to learn by yourself is that you pick up a raft of bad habits that will bite you later. Bethwaite has a lot to say about this in his third book. Its nicely encapsulated, I think, on the choice between centre main and transom main on beginners boats. Stern sheeting and tacking facing aft is completely intuitive, easy to teach, and hands and feet naturally fall in the right place. Centre sheeting tacking facing forward is a pain in the neck, involves umpteen tangles and all that steering behind your back business. Edited by JimC - 27 Jan 20 at 9:30am |
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ian.r.mcdonald
Far too distracted from work
Joined: 24 Feb 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 440 |
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Posted: 27 Jan 20 at 9:30am |
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We live in a world where most are more interested in " covering their back" than doing their best.
I did 7 years as a full time instructor ( last century !) and my perception is that learning is much more complicated nowadays. I forget the name of the author, but I remember an autobiography covering some very radical dinghy cruising moving through to lots of top level offshore racing ( and winning) including involvement in organising races. And then not being able to rent a small yacht in the Med because he didnt have the relevant qualification !. Being placed in a boat and working much of it out myself seems to have worked for me. Still learning after 50 years, but doesnt that make it more fun? |
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Jack Sparrow
Really should get out more
Joined: 08 Feb 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2965 |
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Posted: 27 Jan 20 at 9:30am |
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Yes sailing is too complex - but it's the rules that are far too complex. The boats - just a little.
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CapSizer
Newbie
Joined: 29 Dec 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 18 |
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Posted: 27 Jan 20 at 10:24am |
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OK ... but don't you think there is a danger of letting perfect become the enemy of good enough? Better a sailor with some bad habits than no sailor at all.
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