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Which Laser sail?
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Late starter View Drop Down
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Posts: 481 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Late starter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Which Laser sail?
    Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 1:17pm
I've got an oldie but goody Laser stuck in the back of the boat park that I really fancy getting on the water next year. I bought it for my kids to sail, so it's got a decent 4.7 rig but the standard sail that came with it is probably 20+ years old, like the rest of the boat. All I want to do is some low key club racing, so I was planning to try and find a half decent second hand sail from somewhere. Anyway I had a look on ebay yesterday and blimey, there are a lot of sail choices out there for someone who wants a new standard rig laser sail !    Laser Performance seem to be selling their own range of "training" sails, which I assume are no longer class legal, or I can buy replica sails, which again I assume are not class legal, or I can buy an official class legal sail which now seems to cost over £500. And to make life even more complicated there now seems to be mk2 sails from all the above to consider too so there are plenty of permutations to consider.

We don't have a Laser fleet at my club anymore so I've got nothing to compare against, but what do other clubs do ?   Do clubs insist on fully class legal Laser sails for club racing as with class events?  Are all replica's allowed ?   And what's the opinion on the mk2 sail on an old boat like mine ?   I think I'm leaning towards a replica sail of some kind, as I can't justify a £500 sail on a boat that isn't worth much more than that.
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GybeFunny View Drop Down
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Posts: 403 		Post Options Post Options   Quote GybeFunny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 2:09pm
We fleet race lasers and allow class legal and replica sails. Some people have mk1s and some mk2s.

I have never used a mk2 so am interested in what people think of them too.
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Gordon 1430 View Drop Down
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Posts: 310 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Gordon 1430 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 2:11pm
Hi
Most clubs turn a blind eye to using replica or training sails for club racing and with the issues with the UK laser builder its got worse. I would look for a training sail and not worry about it being class legal. Sorry don't sail a laser so cant help on who does the best one or mk1 versis mk2.
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Gordon
Gordon
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3400 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 2:40pm
Same advice here, and a training sail built from heavier cloth than the standard Laser item will last longer too.
Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
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Guests View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 3:01pm
How quaint you're considering one of the white sails. These days you have the extra choice of the Bethwaite "Dontcha Wish Your Laser Rig Was Hot Like Me" C rigs inspired by the Pussycat Dolls and the LP "Handbags and Gladrags" ARC rigs inspired by Rod Stewart.
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Mark Aged 42 View Drop Down
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Posts: 98 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Mark Aged 42 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 3:17pm
I have a Lennon sail full size and a Holt radial. Both are like new, and perform better than 20 year old shagged out sails by a huge amount. I strongly suspect the differences between products from the different replica brands are insignificant. As we used to say in windsurfing - "Just rig it and sail it". 
A new sail from any brand will feel really good compared to what you have now, and in particular help you enjoy the stronger winds, where a flatter (un stretched) sail will be manageable.
You didnt say if your boat has any XD kit.
If it doesnt, invest in the XD kicker as a minimum. 
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eric_c View Drop Down
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Posts: 382 		Post Options Post Options   Quote eric_c Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 5:09pm
It's worth looking at Intensity Sail in the US
http://www.intensitysails.com/prsaforlamk2.html

Sail is currently $150, shipping will be about $75 for one sail or $85 for two.
On top of that, you may or may not get charged Import Duty at 12% and VAT on top at 20%

Which makes it about the same as some of  the others, but it's in 4.5oz Challenge Dacron.
Unfortunately it will arrive folded.

In my view, the differences between Mk1 and Mk2 are minor, maybe the Mk1 would actually be a little more versatile, setting reasonably with less kicker in lighter air, if pretty much all Mk1 sails weren't clapped out now.
Small differences show up in class racing, half a boat length gets you 1st at the mark but doesn't matter that much on PY very often.
The 'class compliant' illegal sail from Laser is nicer than most replicas IMHO.
There seems to be a steady trickle of unused Mk1s on Facebook or ebay, might be worth considering for light air venues or perhaps if you are on the light side?

Has anyone seen one of those ARC rigs? looked a bit creased in the photo?
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By The Lee View Drop Down
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Posts: 114 		Post Options Post Options   Quote By The Lee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 6:42pm
Replica sails are notoriously band imitations and in my opinion are a false economy. You are much better off buying a second hand lightly used sail from olympic campagainer. Mark 2 is the only way to go a much nicer sail and lasts much longer. Does require a slightly different setup though
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eric_c View Drop Down
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Posts: 382 		Post Options Post Options   Quote eric_c Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 6:59pm
Originally posted by By The Lee

Replica sails are notoriously band imitations and in my opinion are a false economy. You are much better off buying a second hand lightly used sail from olympic campagainer. Mark 2 is the only way to go a much nicer sail and lasts much longer. Does require a slightly different setup though

If you come across genuinely lightly used sails at a fair price, the are great, but an awful lot of people will advertise sails as 'excellent' if they don't actually have any holes in.
The squaddies seem to use their sails in a lot of wind and leave them flapping a lot, a week of that is equivalent to a season's fair use in a class where sails get raised and dropped at the water's edge.


I think someone on here suggested getting the same 'replica' as your mates, so you get the closest thing to level raciing?
I have bought plenty of secondhand sails in other classes.
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3400 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 19 at 11:03pm
Originally posted by By The Lee

Replica sails are notoriously band imitations and in my opinion are a false economy.

I think that's probably not true, Laser branded sails are notoriously expensive (as, indeed are many SMOD sails, if you have a monopoly, milk it, is good business practice) there is no reason why a replica should be inferior to a class legal/button fitted sail. There are certainly good reasons for a class to have a single builder/sailmaker (and not only SMOD classes) but they don't apply across the board.  I'm sure there are some cheap, poorly made replicas out there but there are many made by reputable sailmakers that are every bit as well made as an original. There are even some mk2 replicas appearing (I can't imagine this is remotely sub-standard https://www.roostersailing.com/pd/Replacement-MK2-Standard-Laser-Sail-Combo-Deal_107523.htm which should be a good option for the club sailor.


Edited by Sam.Spoons - 09 Dec 19 at 11:06pm
Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
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