Change the PY System?

Originally posted by RS400atC I'm saying that a digital compass is a great aid to seeing windshifts, way better than what Lasers are allowed. Annoying when you've got  a TackTick for your other boat!

Tactical compasses are permitted on Lasers but it would be unusual to spot one near the front of a Qualifier / Europeans / Worlds fleet

Originally posted by Sam.Spoons But not digital ones (i.e. a TackTick as it's the only game in town on a dinghy). A glass bowl compass requires more, potentially distracting, mental effort to interpret the info it provides. And the top guys are pretty damn good at spotting shifts without needing help anyway. A TackTick is much easier to interpret at a glance allowing the skipper to keep his head out of the boat for most of the time. I suspect it's the mid fleet sailors who would benefit the most from a digital compass, especially on open water.

I think I struggle to get my head around the notion of a TackTick making a Laser sailor 1% quicker, and the implicit impact on PY. At my home club we have the biggest spread in ability of Laser sailors that I think I've ever observed, where it's not unusual for the guys with the compasses to be 15% slower around the course than the top guys.



Edited by sandgrounder - 24 Jul 17 at 2:00pm

The intent of handicap rules by rights should predict/ measure/ assess a perfect example of a classes performance POTENTIAL in the steady state ( meaning boat performance in a straight line in some certain condition or condistikns, on some point or points of sail) whilst being sailed by a perfect sailor.
Of course py, which in my opinion is by far the least imperfect way of handicapping disparate racing dinghies, is based on empirical feedback so may, beneath a sh*t load of noise, show up that 1% of club level kestrel (other classes are available)) sailors spent 3% more of The time pointing 2% closer to the windward mark on account of a speed puck or whatever, IT DOES NOT MAKE THE BOAT GO FASTER THROUGH THE WATER.. IT GIVES THE IDIOT ON THE TILLER EVEN MORE INFORMATION TO MISUSE!
SOME NICER BLOCKS ON A LASER DO NOT MAKE IT GO FASTER THROUGH THE WATER. IT JUST MEANS THAT A LESS THAN PERFECT SAILOR MAY FALL SLIGHTLY LESS SHORT OF THE PERFECT SAILOR'S ABILITY TO GET AROUND AN ENTIRE RACECOURSE IN VARIABLE CONDITIONS
If anything a compass, digital or other, will cause an smod to go slower through the water in the steady state.
A 20kg weight reduction, an increase in spinnaker area, a change to carbon spars or some Other structural alteration to a classes basis will affect how quickly it goes through the water thus should be scrutinised in light of effect on py. These other bits are completely caught in the noise, even before you consider that in the laser class in particular, most of the medals and championships in tbe last couple of decades have been won without compasses, and in some cases, without most of the xd kit.

Whatever the ideal though, the PN represents how fast an average sailor in a particular class is compared to the average sailors of a different class. It doesn't include the few top sailors who only enter the Nationals of the is, usually various chosen classes. If we take the premise that good club sailors are 15% faster around the course than beginner/improvers (as suggested by sandgrounder) then the potential for any boat should be around 7.5% faster than the numbers suggest?

I thought it was supposed to somehow compensate for crew skill factor and end up as a base comparison between boats sailed by equal ability crews. The bit I don't quite understand is how a boat like the Solo, which adds a not insignificant 100ish new (mainly FRP with laminate sails I think) boats to the fleet every year gets slower according to the PY. I know there are lots of older boats, with older sails sailed at club level but with a significant number of new boats being added to the fleet each year I cant quite see how the 'base' Solo has gotten slower compared to boats around unless the crew skill factor is skewing it.