CASC and rating revaluations

   Last year, when HMRC came up with all sorts of silly participation record keeping and mandatory minimum levels, we decided to drop out of CASC
After a year of chasing, we've finally had a response from our Council and also the new Rateable Value Assessment.

Ouch

A four-fold Rateable Value increase plus losing all the CASC discount suddenly gets untenably expensive

Any other clubs been whacked with massive Rates rises, inside or outside CASC? If so, what is the plan?

I'm thinking we not only appeal the increase (of course, it's a nonsense) but change our membership categories and go back into CASC.

And should the RYA not have kicked HMRC into touch on this participation thing anyway?  We are purely a sailing club, not a Pub with a bit of sport on the side. 

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fab100 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 15 Mar 11 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1005	Post Options Post Reply Quote fab100 Report Post Quote Reply Topic: CASC and rating revaluations Posted: 11 Apr 17 at 9:39am
	Last year, when HMRC came up with all sorts of silly participation record keeping and mandatory minimum levels, we decided to drop out of CASC After a year of chasing, we've finally had a response from our Council and also the new Rateable Value Assessment. Ouch A four-fold Rateable Value increase plus losing all the CASC discount suddenly gets untenably expensive Any other clubs been whacked with massive Rates rises, inside or outside CASC? If so, what is the plan? I'm thinking we not only appeal the increase (of course, it's a nonsense) but change our membership categories and go back into CASC. And should the RYA not have kicked HMRC into touch on this participation thing anyway? We are purely a sailing club, not a Pub with a bit of sport on the side.
	Great book for Club Sailors here

RS400atC Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 04 Dec 08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3011	Post Options Post Reply Quote RS400atC Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Apr 17 at 11:43am
	Have you looked at the rates reductions available because your club ranks as a 'small business'? Not sure if that's based on profit or turnover? Is the rates valuation on the basis of your premises being effectively a pub, when that is something you would need planning permission for?

iGRF Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6499	Post Options Post Reply Quote iGRF Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Apr 17 at 11:59am
	We went for the small business rates revue and secured a 10 grand rebate a couple of years back in my first year as commodore, very welcome.
	Snow Equipment Deals New Core Kite website

The Moo Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 01 Jun 06 Online Status: Offline Posts: 809	Post Options Post Reply Quote The Moo Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Apr 17 at 1:43pm
	We are not a CASC, have a bar license and have just had 100% discretionary relief confirmed by our local authority. As a very small club our income is probably minuscule compared to others.

fab100 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 15 Mar 11 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1005	Post Options Post Reply Quote fab100 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Apr 17 at 5:56pm
	Council not seem interesting in giving us any discretionary relief, which is a bit disappointing considering we appear on the cover of their marketing brochure (I know, I know) RS - sorry the 'pub' thing is a red-herring (it was just the driver for HMRC's changing the CASC rules, trying to stop CASC relief use by drinking-clubs with a bit of sport). Rateable value is supposedly assessed based on rental value of the demise. But given there is virtually no alternative use, it's really just a nonsensical money-grabbing try-on. We will be appealing as iGRF suggests. When I did work in the actual pub trade, we had professionals working on those all the time.
	Great book for Club Sailors here

drifter Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Posting king Joined: 09 Jun 08 Location: Oxfordshire Online Status: Offline Posts: 177	Post Options Post Reply Quote drifter Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Apr 17 at 8:59pm
	Hi fab. We dropped out of CASC too on the basis of record keeping being impossible. Looking for experiences of other clubs in the same boat (sic) Edited by drifter - 11 Apr 17 at 9:00pm
	Stewart

423zero Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 08 Jan 15 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3420	Post Options Post Reply Quote 423zero Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Apr 17 at 10:06pm
	This issue soaks up loads of time that would be better spent trying to get new members, their could be a correlation between time now spent on paperwork and decline in sailing.

PeterG Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 12 Jan 08 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 822	Post Options Post Reply Quote PeterG Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 12 Apr 17 at 4:06pm
	Thankfully, I haven't had to deal with this issue, I moved clubs from where I was secretary, and where the club was a CASC, while HMRC were still "consulting" on the changes. However, I'd always assumed that you would be able to do a pretty good job of record keeping from the racing results and the training rota. That wouldn't work, of course, if you had a lot of non racing sailing going on. But in a predominantly racing club I'd have thought the work involved in putting together the racing results at the end of the year, to check participation, was probably worth the guaranteed 80% rate relief, if you weren't going to get it otherwise.
	Peter Ex Cont 707 Ex Laser 189635 DY 59

423zero Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 08 Jan 15 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3420	Post Options Post Reply Quote 423zero Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 12 Apr 17 at 6:07pm
	The red tape now being generated for a voluntary organisation is pushing volunteer members to the edge, we only have about 40 members, half of these think the other half are paid proffessionals to wait on them, bulk of work falls on the shoulders of half a dozen people.

JimC Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662	Post Options Post Reply Quote JimC Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 12 Apr 17 at 6:26pm
	Bureaucracy is like extra weight building a boat I think, every little addition seems perfectly reasonable on its own, but when they're all added together suddenly its 50lbs overweight...