Alto Refurb

   Not quite as simple as that. You need a positive slope from front to back at the most extreme bow down trim you will ever use, otherwise you end up with a puddle at the front in light airs and if you're going to do without a transom you need enough buoyancy aft to support helm weight while putting the rudder on.

Self draining boats that don't quite self drain are spectacularly irritating to sail.

Poll Question: Should I
Poll Choice	Votes	Poll Statistics
Bring it back to as close to class original as possible	6	[60.00%]
Fully stealth it, carbon dome deck, bottom wash thru insert.	4	[40.00%]
You can not vote in this poll

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JimC Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662	Post Options Post Reply Quote JimC Report Post Quote Reply Topic: Alto Refurb Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 8:30pm
	Not quite as simple as that. You need a positive slope from front to back at the most extreme bow down trim you will ever use, otherwise you end up with a puddle at the front in light airs and if you're going to do without a transom you need enough buoyancy aft to support helm weight while putting the rudder on. Self draining boats that don't quite self drain are spectacularly irritating to sail.

Woodburner Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Far too distracted from work Joined: 13 Mar 15 Location: Folkestone Kent Online Status: Offline Posts: 332	Post Options Post Reply Quote Woodburner Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 8:25pm
	Er five fingers? That's not fair, they mostly have six over there, one eyed man in the kingdom of the blind eh, no wonder the yardstick is dropping by the minute. As it happens, Mike did consider raising the floor we talked about it ages ago, but at the time he was busy being jerked around by the various manufacturers and dealers so had other things on his mind. It's probably not going to happen but to do it, the only bit that has to be raised is the mid section where the crew operates and if you think about it, it just needs raising to the floor level at the stern so the height would be uniform and you'd get a bit of buoyancy from the foam as well as water displacement, which would be welcome given when we do get swamped, it's like a bloody cold bath tub and it lasts at least the length of a beat. Anyway I've just got a mail from Jo with loads on it to consider, so it's getting more unlikely by the hour... Edited by Woodburner - 01 Jun 15 at 8:26pm
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iiiiitick Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 19 May 15 Online Status: Offline Posts: 240	Post Options Post Reply Quote iiiiitick Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 6:32pm
	....goodness me felamelad....do not use logigc with ole' Woodbuggerer.....!

Alto-Tim Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Newbie Joined: 23 Jun 11 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6	Post Options Post Reply Quote Alto-Tim Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 6:03pm
	Me as one of those five fingered banjo playing hillbillies based on the Medway Riviera, our little bit concerned of what's going on with one of our flock. The boat was always designed for freedom of movement, comfort ,controllability and ease-of-use. Putting a self draining or anything thereof would breach one of the fundamental design features, as I understand when Mike was designing the boat he looked at the milk crate test which as I understand the 59 was built on that principle but with consideration and trying one decided to go for comfort. I myself having a 59 for five years on the Medway do know about how comfortable and Alto is compared to the self draining options laser 4000, iso, buzz, which I can say myself is, back hurting knee jarring, bruised ankle , and the odd trickle of blood down the leg as you yet again geld yourself on something, but it's all part of that wonderful class which the people enjoy; it comes with that particular boat!, it's a good job are all individuals and have choice. I like to think that 99% of the time the boat is sailed in an upper right fashion giving comfort and ease of use where 1% of the time losing the water is a small price to pay , rather than 99% of the time wishing you was in something comfortable but O look the water runs away. We have just done a deal with and Alto sailor has traded in his boat and brought 122 new and is at Whitstable yacht club. We have two new boat in stock and always carry spares for our customers quick attention and prompt service. Any major modification would require dispensation from the Alto class Association before it could go ahead with dispensation to try, please put it on the agenda for next years AGM to be discussed then. I myself can't see much hope. The Alto has mikes swinging pole system which gives the boat a different dimention to all the others where we can run dead downwind, this requires a bit more mechanics at the front of the boat but again considering the features and the benefits outweigh any slight speed improvement. Medway hillbilly. Tim. Edited by Alto-Tim - 01 Jun 15 at 6:04pm

iiiiitick Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 19 May 15 Online Status: Offline Posts: 240	Post Options Post Reply Quote iiiiitick Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 5:30pm
	I like the idea of raising the floor a bit, why not? will it matter if your knees are 2" closer to your chin? Someone made a flat floor open transom Graduate once but the Grad rocker is big for a 12' boat so it was sailed with knees higher than ears. married couple as I recall.......wonder if boat or relationship went first...?

Rupert Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956	Post Options Post Reply Quote Rupert Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 4:54pm
	Must be a trick of the light, the colour. As for the rest of it, if you like the platform but not the way it is set up, then why not muck around with it. After all, you'll be after a boat to beat all comers, seeing as yardstick sailing isn't your cup of tea, so you need to make it quick and easy to sail, then go for on the water victories. Should beat the Toppers easily...
	Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686

rich96 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 20 Jan 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 596	Post Options Post Reply Quote rich96 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 4:49pm
	I'm sure that a local scaffolding firm would be happy to remove all the junk from the bow ? Is there a worse point to add all that weight ?

Woodburner Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Far too distracted from work Joined: 13 Mar 15 Location: Folkestone Kent Online Status: Offline Posts: 332	Post Options Post Reply Quote Woodburner Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 4:20pm
	It's big in Banjo land up the Medway where they reach up and down this river all day ruining the class handicap. Before I flipped it I filled it with water until the water flowed out the back, it was about two inches deep at the centre point where the self balers are sighted, my plan is to shape some styro foam and sit it in the bottom, it'll still have to have cut outs for the balers I guess, but if it gives a level path from front to back it should direct the water out, then my plan was to double the size of those flaps at the back. As to sitting in, the crew is out on the wire and I spend half my time hanging over the side or with my feet hooked under that centre console thing as the footstrap isn't that well sighted. I won't resin it all into place unless it works it'll be like a false floor I guess. Then maybe I'll get fed up and not bother depending how well everything else goes. Rupert here's what colour it was new before it sailed on the brown English channel obviously.. Edited by Woodburner - 01 Jun 15 at 4:26pm
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alstorer Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 02 Aug 07 Location: Cambridge Online Status: Offline Posts: 2899	Post Options Post Reply Quote alstorer Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 3:31pm
	is there much point in "class legal" when the class is almost non-existent?
	-_ Al

Rupert Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956	Post Options Post Reply Quote Rupert Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 01 Jun 15 at 3:11pm
	Odd about the colour. The inside doesn't look blue at all in the PIC. To make it self draining, you'd need to add a false floor high enough to drain through the back. The boat looks like it has a fair amount of rocker compared to many modern designs(a good thing, I think), but it means the floor would have to be very deep forwards, so you lose the sit in not on purpose of the boat. You may have thought of another way, of course?
	Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686