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GarethT View Drop Down
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Posts: 714 		Post Options Post Options   Quote GarethT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Personal Handicaps
    Posted: 16 Nov 14 at 2:39pm
Try thinking of it as ........ a bit of fun!
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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 14 at 1:47pm
So what is the distance between you and the class champion and how has it changed over the last 3 seasons?
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Bootscooter View Drop Down
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Posts: 1094 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Bootscooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 14 at 1:30pm
I can understand a series being dual scored, but I can't get my head around the principle of PH being anything other than condescending.

As an example, I believe that golf handicaps work in a similar way (?), but if I went out for a round with a pro and got round in 20 more than him/her there's no way I could consider myself to have "won", if I got a 21 shot advantage via handicap because I'm not very good.

Does that make sense?

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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 14 at 1:15pm
The way we run personal handicaps is as follows.
Previous seasons results are put in a spreadsheet, one sheet per series. Export crrected times from saiwave.
The spreadsheet converts corrected times to % of winners corrected time. Spreadsheet then calculates average % from winner and number of finishes for each competitor.
Each series goes to another sheet. All the results are averaged with most recent results weighted, so it spits out for each competior a %, varying from about 102 for regular racewinners up to 125 or more. Spreadsheet then allocates each sailor to a 'band' band 0 is 100-104.9%,band 1 105% -109.9 etc.
If in band 0 you get sad handicap, bwnd 1 handicap plus 5% etc.
So everyone has a series of milestones they can progress through, and we use the personal handicaps in two series which are dual scored.
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zippyRN View Drop Down
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Posts: 437 		Post Options Post Options   Quote zippyRN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 14 at 12:59pm
as others have alluded to  it depends on the context 

in a pursuit race  it should in theory produce  closer finishes 

across a series of conventional races  the most improved  will win. 
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The Moo View Drop Down
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Posts: 809 		Post Options Post Options   Quote The Moo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 14 at 11:32am
I should have said generally over the length of the series.Might try and respond more fully when I have a bit more time and am using a proper keyboard!
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Bootscooter View Drop Down
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Posts: 1094 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Bootscooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 14 at 11:23am
Really? Surely the winner (in this situation) will be the one that performs above their previous standard the most (as per the previous results used to calculate the PH)?
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The Moo View Drop Down
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Posts: 809 		Post Options Post Options   Quote The Moo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 14 at 11:18am
Generally the same people will win but the racing will be much closer (in a pursuit race)
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Bootscooter View Drop Down
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Posts: 1094 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Bootscooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 14 at 11:07am
There's probably factors I haven't considered about personal handicaps (which is why I am posting this, in order to be educated), but I really don't get it...

Forgetting for one moment the perceived issues with the PY system, why would a PH system be required? I kind of see that it can show progression and development, but surely I could see that in the distance between me and the "class champion" at the Club?
As iiTick mentioned in another thread, is it not a bit condescending to award a "win" to someone that has clearly not sailed as well as someone else, purely because they didn't sail as badly as they did previously?

Please don't think I'm against encouraging newcomers the sport, but couldn't this be done with a "Most Improved" trophy for a series, awarded by comparing scores from the previous series, but without the "smoke and mirrors" of a PH?

As I say, I'm happy to be educated on something I'm not aware of with these systems, so please tell me the advantages of PHs.
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