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Rupert View Drop Down
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    Posted: 23 Feb 14 at 9:44pm
Fast boats are rubbish, too hard to sail, too complicated have to spend all your time practicing, be in the industry, be a sailing god...

Yes, we have had all those views and more on here. Often from the same person, though.

Of course fast boats will have a smaller catchment - they do need committment, and skill, to sail. Some people have both, and enjoy the capsizing as well, however, and I for one tip my hat to you all.
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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 14 at 10:20pm
Well I've often said that fast boats don't seem to be nearly as popular as they used to be, and drawn from that the conclusion that fast boats are unlikely to be the "future of sailing". Anyone who draws conclusions from that about what boats I personally like needs to take a quick look at my profile.

Its just that one thing I've learned over the years is that very few things I am personally enthusiastic about seem to be popular with the mass market, so using my own preferences as a guide to where the mass market might go is quite futile.

Edited by JimC - 23 Feb 14 at 10:22pm
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 14 at 10:25pm
What is regarded as a fast boat is now faster and harder to sail than a fast boat was 30 years ago. Then, a Fireball was fast, Now, I read reports where they were in the medium handicap. Maybe fast boats lose out because people who want a fast boat will no longer bother looking at boats like the Fireball, which would be within their skill set, as the perception is that they are "slow"? Then they find they can't sail the whizz bang 3000, so go and buy a jet ski instead?
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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Posts: 2003 		Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 14 at 11:12pm
Fast boats are great fun, I'm just not convinced they make good club racing choices. And given the cost, I find windsurfing more accessible for high performance sailing, but that's just me.
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Posts: 6499 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 14 at 11:53pm
Originally posted by Rupert

Then they find they can't sail the whizz bang 3000, so go and buy a Cat instead?


FTFY
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Posts: 2041 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 14 at 12:06am
Originally posted by Presuming Ed

Originally posted by JimC

there were also quite a few of local one design keelboats, something you don't see so much of these days.

That would be an interesting list. Wouldn't be at all surprised to see that many local one designs are more popular now than they were in the mid 80s. Classic boat revival really started in the late 80s, early 90s. Doubt they submit PY returns any more - all the one's I've heard of race OD. 

PY listings of some local keel ODs from the '62 YA yearbook, with a few other classes thrown in for comparison. Figures in bracket are the dacron sail PYs, others are for cotton. My list of local classes is in storage (I hope) so I may have misidentified some.

National Flying 15 = (89) 90
Int Dragon = 90
Int Star = 83
Int 14 = (88) 89
Nat Merlin Rocket = (91) 96
Nat 12 = (98) 103
YW Solo = (102) 103
Nat Enterprise = (98) 103

FD =(79)
National Swallow = 91
Solent SUnbeam = 92
Gt Yarmouth OD = 92
Broads OD, Spitfire, Waveney, Horning REbel OD, Yare and Bure OD all =94
Folkboat (stripped) = 95
Tumlaren = 95
Atlanta = 95
Liverpool Bay Falcon = 96
SCOD = (94)
X Class, Essex OD, TEOD all = 100
WOrthing OD = 103
Victory OD = (100) 103
Benfleet OD, Royal Harwich OD, St Mawes OD, Weymouth Falcon OD, Emsworth OD bermudan, Loch Long OD all = 107.
Enterprise cruising rig = (105) 108 - what happened to it?
Salcombe Restricted Yawl = (104) 108

No Seabird Half Rater number to be found.

EDIT - found my '61 and '64 yardsticks, so here's some more local keelboat (IIRC) figures

Daring = (90)
22 sq metre = 89
30 sq Metre Windfall = 85
Coronation = 107
Seabird Half Rater = 110
Menai Straits OD = 110
Pleiad and Wivenhoe OD = 109
Scimitar = (97)
5.5 Metre (84)
Reedling (90)
Essex OD (95) 100

Also to further back up Jim's point, the books these came from also contain info on designs that (AFAIK) never even got PYs, such as the YW Explorer, Poole AB, Kombi, Flying Tern, PI, Tricorn, Peregrine, Top 10, Cob, Tempo, Seadog. There were lots and lots of new designs in those days but there were also lots and lots of boats being built around the world. Many classes were growing at the rate of 1000 boats per year.




Edited by Chris 249 - 24 Feb 14 at 12:47am
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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Posts: 2003 		Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 14 at 8:52am
Originally posted by iGRF

Originally posted by Rupert

Then they find they can't sail the whizz bang 3000, so go and buy a Cat instead?


FTFY

there's some truth in that- the most popular group within our fast handicap class is the Dart 15... so not only a cat, but a cheap, crap cat at that.
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Posts: 106 		Post Options Post Options   Quote pondlife1736 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 14 at 9:28am

there's some truth in that- the most popular group within our fast handicap class is the Dart 15... so not only a cat, but a cheap, crap cat at that.
[/QUOTE]


Ouch !! That hurt!  Seriously though, most cats are too big and fast for our pond. 
Didn't notice any 'high performance' boats out with us yesterday, either. At least the Darts gave it a try.
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Posts: 6499 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 14 at 9:38am
Cats - Jet Ski's, basically the same thing.
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Presuming Ed View Drop Down
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Posts: 641 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Presuming Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 14 at 10:23am
Originally posted by Chris 249

[QUOTE=Presuming Ed]

National Swallow = 91

yup - Itchenor

Solent SUnbeam = 92

Y - new boats being built

Gt Yarmouth OD = 92

Broads OD, Spitfire, Waveney, Horning REbel OD, Yare and Bure OD all =94

Broads OD & Y&B OD (Brown boats & white boats)

Folkboat (stripped) = 95

Y

Tumlaren = 95
Atlanta = 95
Liverpool Bay Falcon = 96

Y  www.lbfa.org.uk/‎

SCOD = (94) Boats, but AFAIAA, no class. 
X Class, Essex OD, TEOD all = 100

XOD - Y. Back to biggest fleet at Cowes week. 

WOrthing OD = 103
Victory OD = (100) 103

Y

Benfleet OD, Royal Harwich OD, St Mawes OD, Weymouth Falcon OD, Emsworth OD bermudan, Loch Long OD all = 107.

St Mawes & Lock Long - Y. (Does Thomas Dolby - "she blinded me with science/hyperactive" still sail Loch Longs?)

Enterprise cruising rig = (105) 108 - what happened to it?
Salcombe Restricted Yawl = (104) 108

Y 

Daring = (90)

Y - new boats being built/old boat re-hulled.

22 sq metre = 89
30 sq Metre Windfall = 85
Coronation = 107
Seabird Half Rater = 110

Y

Menai Straits OD = 110

Y

Pleiad and Wivenhoe OD = 109

WOD? - http://www.wivenhoesailing.org.uk

Scimitar = (97)
5.5 Metre (84)
Reedling (90)
Essex OD (95) 100 / Estury OD? - Y

Plus others not mentioned: Mermaids, Redwings, Yorkshire ODs, Conway Fife OD, Windemere 17 (not OD), Troys, Yarmouth (IoW) Y boats Fairy etc. Some pretty long-standing survivors there. 
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