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Confusng Situations

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    Posted: 04 Aug 10 at 11:12am
Originally posted by The Moo

Duncan

Having sat on protest committees where protestor and protestee could not agree on what actually happened one hour after the race. The likelihood of you and I now agreeing to exactly that actually happened months ago and therefore coming up with the correct resolution is pretty much zilch.

If the situation happened as you describe (which is where we do not fully agree) then clearly your question has already been answered earlier in this thread. So live long and prosper

We are away this weekend but will be at the Club next Wednesday evening.   Not sure when we will see you guys next so can you get in contact (not via forum ) to discuss arrangements for keys etc.   


cheers, will be in touch.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Aug 10 at 10:36am
Originally posted by The Moo

...The likelihood of you and I now agreeing to exactly that actually happened months ago and therefore coming up with the correct resolution is pretty much zilch.

It may of course be apocryphal, but I heard a story of a protest hearing where about the only thing the two parties could agree on was that they were both on port. Some video evidence turned up, which was very little help as is often the case, but one of the few things it did clarify was that both parties were on starboard...

The human memory is a very strange thing!

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Post Options Post Options   Quote The Moo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Aug 10 at 8:19am
Duncan

Having sat on protest committees where protestor and protestee could not agree on what actually happened one hour after the race. The likelihood of you and I now agreeing to exactly that actually happened months ago and therefore coming up with the correct resolution is pretty much zilch.

If the situation happened as you describe (which is where we do not fully agree) then clearly your question has already been answered earlier in this thread. So live long and prosper

We are away this weekend but will be at the Club next Wednesday evening.   Not sure when we will see you guys next so can you get in contact (not via forum ) to discuss arrangements for keys etc.   
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ex laser View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ex laser Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Aug 10 at 2:24pm
i retired because i did not want to risk elaines boat, if i had been sailing the lightning i would have discussed it with you on the water, loudly! because you had not cleared the mark.

therefore, if you were clear ahead coming to the mark, tack onto port and i am still on starboard at the mark. who has the rights?

anyway mate,let it go mate,its not important.
at least i know the rules for next time, which is the only important thing.


look after yourself and i hope you have good sailing for the next few weeks.
 i will not be sailing at the club for atleast four weeks( weddings,moth  nationals, holidays and club duties are all getting in the way)

and i promise not to post for a while!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



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Post Options Post Options   Quote The Moo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Aug 10 at 8:33am
Well enjoy your laugh at my expense mate, but my recollection of the situation is that I went into the zone clear ahead, you tried to get into gap between me and the mark and the door was shut on you and we tangled whilst rounding the mark. I recall my rounding of the mark involved heading up on a closehauled course and any tack came after I had left the mark astern and not as part of the rounding (which this thread discussion was originally about)

If I was aggrieved at being called starboard on it was because I felt that there were unresolved issues from our tangling during the mark rounding.

Like I said it would have been good to have discussed it further at the time but if I recall correctly you retired from the race after that incident which made it impossible.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ex laser Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Aug 10 at 3:44am
sorry mate it was the same.

we were coming from no6 and going to no 4. we were both on starboard, you were clear ahead and tacked wide round no1, i shouted starboard and you told me i could not do that because you had rights at the mark!

thats why i find this thread so so so very very funny!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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Post Options Post Options   Quote The Moo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Aug 10 at 4:56pm
Originally posted by ex laser


Originally posted by The Moo

Gordon

A nice clear explanation of Situation 2. Quite scary how few people (in my experience)actually seem to understand it or choose to ignore it in practice and tack round a mark without any regards to the boat behind.
i could not agree more martin, shame you did not remember it at mark no 1 the week i sailed elaines moth!!!!!!!!!!


Duncan. I'm struggling to remember the finer detail but I do have a recollection of tangling with you during a rounding of Mark no 1 a while back. However, unlike Situation 2 described by the OP, I thought the approach to it on that day was sailing offwind from No 4 or similar and heading up close hauled as we rounded. If it is the same incident I don't recollect actually tacking to round the mark before leaving it astern and getting in your way.

Shame that we did not discuss this on the day really....
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ex laser Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Aug 10 at 1:48pm
Originally posted by The Moo

Gordon

A nice clear explanation of Situation 2. Quite scary how few people (in my experience)actually seem to understand it or choose to ignore it in practice and tack round a mark without any regards to the boat behind.


i could not agree more martin, shame you did not remember it at mark no 1 the week i sailed elaines moth!!!!!!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote The Moo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Aug 10 at 11:10am
Gordon

A nice clear explanation of Situation 2. Quite scary how few people (in my experience)actually seem to understand it or choose to ignore it in practice and tack round a mark without any regards to the boat behind.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Aug 10 at 9:41am
Situation 1.

Rule 18 does not apply. Rule 10 applies and port tack boat must keep clear;

Situation 2

Boat 1 is clear ahead. Boat 2 must keep clear and give mark room. However, as Boat 1 is not overlapped to windward mark room does not include room to tack. If Boat 1 passes head to wind rule 18 ceases to apply, rule 13 applies and Boat 1 must keep clear. As Boat 2 has acquired right of way through the actions of Boat 1 rule 15 does not apply and Boat 2 is not required to give room for Boat 1 to keep clear.

In match racing Boat 1 would slow to try and force Boat 2 to go outside.

Gordon
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