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Anyone know anything about National 18s?

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    Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 6:55pm
,,,,,, I don't care. I trust that people are not cheating, and if anyone does, they are just spoiling it for themselves.

Exactly ....  surely time to let the world move on.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 5:38pm
Nice post Eisvogel .
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 2:50pm
  
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Eisvogel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 2:33pm
It all goes back to Paul Elvström's famous quote: "You haven't won the race, if in winning the race you have lost the respect of your competitors."

We're a mostly self-policing sport, and I for example wouldn't have a clue whether a N18 would sail any different if it was 50kg lighter or not, and frankly, I don't care. I trust that people are not cheating, and if anyone does, they are just spoiling it for themselves.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 1:00pm
I would not have protested, nor objected, if the boat had not got a measurement certificate when they raced (the spirit of the rules is, feel, more important than the letter given that it did subsequently measure) but it was definitely breaking it's own class rules to race without a valid certificate. If anybody had protested it's hard to see how a PC could do anything other that disqualify the boat.

Edited by Sam.Spoons - 08 Feb 18 at 1:01pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote PeterG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 12:44pm
The boat that competed in the SJ event so successfully hadn't been measured, though it has been now.

So we now know, apparently, that the boat was in class, but probably missing the documentation at the time? So it was a new boat hot out out of the moulds and the paperwork not fully complete. That is a legitimate issue, though no one saw it as significant enough to protest at the time. However, it would also appear that any suggestions that the boat was a cheat, in the sense of having a non class legal design or manufacturing advantage are unfounded.

Case closed? And a class few have talked about for years has now had it's internet profile raised considerably!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 12:01pm
 GRFi.... you really need to keep up.  I worked with several sub-contract builders over the years and always did but I have not supplied new boats for more than a couple of years now as I recline into ‘retirement’.... I recall however you have even met with me on one occasion for lunch in Brightlingsea to discuss various projects and ideas of yours.  That was just one builder/supplier and from memory ... you had already fallen out rather badly with our other (then) main sub-contractor without any help from me ! 

The points being made to you by myself and others is that your nudge-nudge wink-wink 'web approach' is fundamentally misguided and the concept of a necessary protest etc seems to have gone over your head.    If taken seriously it creates precedent that makes a joke of historical and proven approaches.     There is already standard method and procedure for flushing out anything 'suspected' to do with racing.  Would seem the sensible point to have started from....  IF that failed at some level THEN you might have had had something more tangible to squawk about.  Might not be the most ‘juicy’story though I guess....

From the little I know the crew involved apparently sailed a class demo boat that fully meets the requirements and standards of the class concerned.... I have no idea whether they carried a formal class certificate, racing insurance or vaccination certificates or whatever   LOL.....  But if I was that bothered, as you obviously are, (or are you really just the stalking horse for  those mysterious and obviously rather shy  ‘others’ ) I'd have protested as should have they ....   Do remember most SMOD classes, and they constitute a very large proportion today, do not even issue certificates. And as an aside I don’t recall anything of the sort to do with board racing way back ... the reasonable presumption was  the stuff flogged by the suppliers would measure.  Please tell us it did ...

It is very possible that the crew are totally ‘innocent’ of your charges and the boat has always been within the measurements and requirements  of the class anyway.    Would they have known even if a CA certificate was still pending or required ?   Are you or is anyone else therefore suggesting  or insinuating that this boat was NOT a regular N18 but was say carrying larger sails or was lighter etc?  Generally demo boats are hardly ‘specials’ – and rather more often are the opposite given the hard life they ‘enjoy’.    

For the record I don’t have any connection with the N18 class, have never sailed one and don’t currently know anyone who does  !    But I am delighted to see that the class is benefitting from all the attention here – and good luck to them.    Perhaps you should ask them for a demo yourself – with your collaborators perhaps.  It would make a great follow up line.... still time to be at the next  ‘Oxford Blue’ SJ event  in a couple of weeks.    

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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 11:54am
Trolls gotta troll.

What with some class rules requiring new certificates when boats change hands, people not bothering to get new sails officially measured until the next time they go to a championships, replica sails and all the other stuff I wouldn't be even mildly surprised if you told me more than half the dinghies racing in the country this weekend won't have current certificates.

As long as it does measure I don't give a damn whether the next boat has a current certificate or not. And even if it doesn't measure (eg replica sails) I don't care so long as the race organisers are aware and OK with it (eg replica sails OK for handicap races if approved).
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Post Options Post Options   Quote L123456 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 11:37am
Originally posted by iGRF

What y'all are missing, is wether or not anything would have happened had it not been plastered all over this forum ...

But nothing has happened ... apart from you chucking a few accusations around on a forum ....
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 18 at 11:23am
Why, was the boat only measured because of a rant on here probably unread by builder, owner, and everyone else involved? Not planned, the boat was going to be used forever unmeasured? I think you might be overestimating your influence on the world of sailing.

You'd better find the documentation timeline, hack the emails of the builder, too uncover the truth. X files is a documentary, too.
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