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Self bailers on rowing skiffs
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DiscoBall View Drop Down
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    Posted: 11 Apr 16 at 7:19pm
Originally posted by Rupert

 Did they use handicaps to decide the winner?

No, indeed...  Wink Though probably far easier to work out empirical handicaps for boats that go along in straight lines within quite a narrow speed range.

In the ski racing we have everything from 16ft to 22ft and 8-20kg racing. Complete menagerie but there's no real concept of one-design and setting up a division for the short/wide/heavy boats is being seen as a bit radical...



 


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Posts: 129 		Post Options Post Options   Quote realnutter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Apr 16 at 5:03pm
I'd have thought a little bellows pump in each footwell, and powered by the last 50mm of seat travel would do the job more simply, and for less weight...
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Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Apr 16 at 4:23pm
Originally posted by DiscoBall


Originally posted by Rupert

Does a 4 ever row against an 8, or a Cornish gig against a Thames hire boat? No, thought not...

Last years' Eddystone Challenge there were ocean rowing boats, gigs, 6 person outriggers, surfskis and seakayaks all as a mass start...might have upset the rowers that they were getting beaten by single kayakers, but sea-going rowers seem a lot friendlier than their inland counterparts.


Did they use handicaps to decide the winner?
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Posts: 246 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JohnJack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Apr 16 at 3:37pm
A rowing boat surges during each stroke, with what ever water is inside the hull sloshing back and forth. I am not sure how effective a selfbailer would be for the amount of turbulence they would create under the hull possibly upsetting the fine equilibrium (top boats only engage the credit card sized rudder/steer when oars are in the water as not to upset the balance, or add extra drag during the non-powered phase of the stroke). Rowing boats, especially eights don't like wind other than the rudder they have a small skeg, not much bigger than the one you get on windsurfers at the back and the front end can have a tendency to slip around allot esp in side/head wind. Having coxed for most of my teenage/early 20's I can recall going under bridges in eight where as soon as the bow is out the other end it will just skip anything up to 20-30 degrees sideways. Headwinds are particularly tough as the boat tends to stall during recovery, oars are difficult to control whilst squaring up, just beofre they enter the water (essentially the turn into a small wing in a head wind with all the gearing against the rower.

Hulls are built to support a specific weight range of the crew, obviously height of the swivel on the rigger (pivot point of the oar) off the water is vital for an efficient handle height through the drive phase as is center of gravity. The crew deck, on which the seats sit on should be as close the floating water line as possible, so when you get wind of tide chop it can get a bit wet.  

The Boat Race probably rows in conditions where most races would be canceled. Male Boat Race Crews tend to be a little on the heavier side, giving a bit more mass. All in with 8 rowers @ c.100kg.ea cox @55kg.ea (min) the boat @ c.80kg and oars a male boat is probably pushing a ton in all, so a fare bit of mass and can generate a fair bit of power to punch through the conditions. The Womens Boat Race (on the Thames) is still in it infancy, they lack the weight and sheer ignorant brute force that the Men do over the distance. They will come on though and it is good to see them there.

The other advantage in a pump is it can have multiple feeds along the boat, so doesn't require all the water/weight to slosh towards the selfbailer before it exits the hull.

There might also be a rule about having things protruding out of the hull as well, I cant remember......
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Posts: 1076 		Post Options Post Options   Quote rogerd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Apr 16 at 2:11pm
Thank you, for your answers, I will leave you to discuss the same grf based stuff you have been mulling over for the last century now.
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Posts: 305 		Post Options Post Options   Quote DiscoBall Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Apr 16 at 10:42am
Originally posted by Rupert

Does a 4 ever row against an 8, or a Cornish gig against a Thames hire boat? No, thought not...

Last years' Eddystone Challenge there were ocean rowing boats, gigs, 6 person outriggers, surfskis and seakayaks all as a mass start...might have upset the rowers that they were getting beaten by single kayakers, but sea-going rowers seem a lot friendlier than their inland counterparts.
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Posts: 641 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Presuming Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Apr 16 at 9:02am
Oarsmen do use handicaps for age-related (veteran) rowing. Simple time allowance for age, IIRC. 
Plus they group boats according to skill. Beginners don't race against experienced crews. 

Fine boats' footwells aren't linked (at least not any more). Rocker is barely existent (an eight is about 65' long (with a rudder half the size of a credit card)). So you would need more than one bailer, and I can't think of a single crew who would accept the extra drag over a pump. 

Also, rowing very rarely takes place in boat swamping conditions. Normally called off if the weather is too bad. It's pretty much only the boat race that goes ahead come what may. 
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Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Apr 16 at 8:10am
Does a 4 ever row against an 8, or a Cornish gig against a Thames hire boat? No, thought not...
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Posts: 301 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Time Lord Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Apr 16 at 10:10pm
Perhaps because it has little to do with PY???
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Posts: 267 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Oinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Apr 16 at 9:16pm
Why is the forum talking about rowing boats?
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