A 'Cyclical' decline in double handed boats?

Originally posted by blaze720 Why should the top of the sport (National Championships) dumb down to the needs of a beginner ... etc etcLets look at it another way.  Do you want good numbers in the sport and at Championships ?  Simple one this ...Yes or No ?  If you do want participation today you have to not only encourage it but have a strategy and attitude that is welcoming.  Do not patronise or even insult newcomers and the club 'middle of the fleet' guys and gals would be a reasonable start.   2/3rds of many nationals fleet will not even get close to winning a single race let alone a whole series in most classes.  The 'middle of the fleet' and back are generally much more capable than you give them credit for anyway and all should want them there.  Most are also realisitic about their real chances.   They do it for other reasons, the occasional 'win' over friends and their regular rivals, the simple enjoyment of sailing close to (their or the) limits and of course the social side of it.  Without them, the backbone of most clubs note, the next generation have nothing to race against and maybe if they decide that racing is not for them we all miss the elite of the future ... thats right their kids, their friends and the next generation they encourage. The trouble with any elite is not the fact that a small group can become very skilled indeed.  It is the attitude of a few that can ultimately damage the sport out of all proportion to their numbers.  I just hope not too many 'newbies' get to read some of the stuff on this forum ....  not really going to get them enthused and into racing is it ?Mike L.

Totally agree Mike, indeed as a helm one of my proudest moments was when we both rounded a mark at Stone in the top few boats, I was so surprised I managed to sail up your transom, however, I have far more, and many more succesful memories and results as a crew...

Jon

Why should the top of the sport (National Championships) dumb down to the needs of a beginner ... etc etc

Lets look at it another way.  Do you want good numbers in the sport and at Championships ?  Simple one this ...Yes or No ?  If you do want participation today you have to not only encourage it but have a strategy and attitude that is welcoming. 

Do not patronise or even insult newcomers and the club 'middle of the fleet' guys and gals would be a reasonable start.   2/3rds of many nationals fleet will not even get close to winning a single race let alone a whole series in most classes.  The 'middle of the fleet' and back are generally much more capable than you give them credit for anyway and all should want them there.  Most are also realisitic about their real chances.   They do it for other reasons, the occasional 'win' over friends and their regular rivals, the simple enjoyment of sailing close to (their or the) limits and of course the social side of it.  Without them, the backbone of most clubs note, the next generation have nothing to race against and maybe if they decide that racing is not for them we all miss the elite of the future ... thats right their kids, their friends and the next generation they encourage.

The trouble with any elite is not the fact that a small group can become very skilled indeed.  It is the attitude of a few that can ultimately damage the sport out of all proportion to their numbers.  I just hope not too many 'newbies' get to read some of the stuff on this forum ....  not really going to get them enthused and into racing is it ?

Mike L. 

Originally posted by GybeFunny Originally posted by iGrf  <span style="line-height: 1.4; : rgb251, 251, 253;">All the more reason that new double handers be encouraged, not handicapped out of existence by short sighted protectionism. </span><span style="line-height: 1.4;"> How can you say with one breath that the RYA should fudge PYs to encourage new double handed classes to take off and then in the next breath you are accusing them of gerrymandering (a word I am not familiar with but according to wikipedia it means establishing advantage by manipulation)?</span> I very much doubt that many people buy a boat based on it having a PY that they believe makes it a bandit and if there are people like this I would suggest that they are sailing for the wrong reasons. It is widely acknowledged that a British Moth would be a bandit on my puddle and yet we dont have any at the club as people have chosen other boats that they prefer over this bandit.

There is a long way between 1018 (the Tasar) and 969. Equally the Alto dropping from 935 to 912, both boats that would encourage entry level participants to double handed sailing are two examples, neither were exactly bandits to begin with.

Nor am I suggesting that, it's an old argument been back and forth and I don't want to go over it again, but the elite tail is wagging the larger market dog and that market is entry level, without it natural wastage erodes the market even faster, which is what is happening to competition dinghy sailing.

That and there appears to be no clear promotional organ encouraging adults into the sport whilst everyone already in it seems intent on putting as many obstacles in their path as possible, from snooty clubs, to complicated and intimidating rules and regulations. This is just another minor speed bump compared to the trauma of a nationals briefing to a neophyte, but then y'all have been neck deep in it for so long, you can't see it from the eyes of a newcomer.

Edited by GybeFunny - 07 Aug 14 at 1:50pm