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Oli View Drop Down
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    Posted: 27 Feb 15 at 5:23pm
The topaz was designed for the smaller / younger / less experienced sailor so by definition it was a multi purpose yet specialised boat, what I'm getting at is so,eating aimed at the fireball / 505 / 400 sailor at the large end and a tad smaller than a 29er at bottom end.  If you design the hull for a certain skill level you may end up with a topaz but you also may not.  There is more than one way to skin a cat.
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Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 15 at 1:15pm
Originally posted by rb_stretch

Originally posted by Chris 249

 
Wouldn't the multi-role boat be better off with a long, skinny hull rather than a short beamy one? The waterlines could change less as the displacement changes in something like a Contender than something like a Merlin.  Apparently it's very hard to get widely flared hulls to work with differing crew weights. 
 
Having had a Formula 16 type cat that would perform well one up or two up, and with or without a kite, I tend to think that one of the big gaps in the market is a boat that would take widely varying rigs and crew weight (to the extent that you could sail it one or two up) but IMHO experience demonstrates that long and skinny boats handle that much better.
 
I have seen a Contender rigged as a two-hander with racks, but it would be interesting to see one with just one trap and a jib and kite, perhaps with the main from another popular class.

That is exactly my view on the subject and the only reason I can think of why we don't have more long, narrow hulls is cost.


And the size of a single garage.
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Posts: 742 		Post Options Post Options   Quote rb_stretch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 15 at 1:11pm
Originally posted by Chris 249

 
Wouldn't the multi-role boat be better off with a long, skinny hull rather than a short beamy one? The waterlines could change less as the displacement changes in something like a Contender than something like a Merlin.  Apparently it's very hard to get widely flared hulls to work with differing crew weights. 
 
Having had a Formula 16 type cat that would perform well one up or two up, and with or without a kite, I tend to think that one of the big gaps in the market is a boat that would take widely varying rigs and crew weight (to the extent that you could sail it one or two up) but IMHO experience demonstrates that long and skinny boats handle that much better.
 
I have seen a Contender rigged as a two-hander with racks, but it would be interesting to see one with just one trap and a jib and kite, perhaps with the main from another popular class.

That is exactly my view on the subject and the only reason I can think of why we don't have more long, narrow hulls is cost.
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Indeed.  'Conventional hull, lots of rigs...':
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 15 at 8:28am
Trouble is multi purpose hulls are generally rubbish at everything. That's the nature of compromise.

[later - rubbish is too strong, perhaps I should have said not particularily good at anything. And a good multi purpose hull design is an achievement in itself, but racing boats targeted at wide variations of displacement or performance are intrinsically going to be a long way short of optimal for any configuration. Imagine an RS200 rig on an RS400 hull for example. Anyone think that would be even half the boat the RS200 is?]

Edited by JimC - 27 Feb 15 at 10:27am
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Oli View Drop Down
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Posts: 1020 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Oli Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 15 at 8:11am
I'd sort of changed my mind to long and skinny when I thought about it in my next post, k6, I just think it'd be an interesting project.  Seems all the talk on here is that general all round hull types (more traditional designs) seems to be popular in the face of skiff hype and what ever else is thrown at them so why not accept that and have fewer more all round hulls with multi rigs? Would suit manufactuers and please the one design fanboys, handicaping it wouldn't make any difference to what we already have.  Make sense in my head but reality is vastly different!  Confused
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Posts: 2041 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 15 at 12:24am
Originally posted by Oli

a lightweight double hander with choice of rigs that could take two 100kg crew down to two 50kg crew.

say 14ft long, wide like a merlin, self tacking jib, small rig unstayed, medium rig stayed hiking, large rig with trap, and a large rig for fattys to hike, all separate classes and not trying to repeat the rs800 situation.  4 boats one hull all bases covered, potential to even sail single handed.


 
Wouldn't the multi-role boat be better off with a long, skinny hull rather than a short beamy one? The waterlines could change less as the displacement changes in something like a Contender than something like a Merlin.  Apparently it's very hard to get widely flared hulls to work with differing crew weights. 
 
Having had a Formula 16 type cat that would perform well one up or two up, and with or without a kite, I tend to think that one of the big gaps in the market is a boat that would take widely varying rigs and crew weight (to the extent that you could sail it one or two up) but IMHO experience demonstrates that long and skinny boats handle that much better.
 
I have seen a Contender rigged as a two-hander with racks, but it would be interesting to see one with just one trap and a jib and kite, perhaps with the main from another popular class.
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Posts: 852 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Andymac Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 15 at 12:04am
First I've heard about the Quest and it has just caught my attention.
My 10 year old son has just joined the Sea Cadets (sorry Jeffers) the age range for the regular Cadets start at 12 (I think the army cadets are 13). But there are a number of units that have 10-12 year old junior section.
I joined myself as a 10 year old back in the last century when they had just introduced a junior section. I owe the organisation a lot since it was they that first introduced me to sailing, and since my son has now joined it looks like it's payback time... I've already taken on the 'boatswain' role.
I can't see a mention of the Quest's hull material GRP or Plastic?
and since this thread is 'published hull weights', how heavy?
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Posts: 3048 		Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 15 at 5:30pm
Originally posted by Riki @ RS

Originally posted by jeffers


Looks like a direct competitor for the Vago to me (but not sure on the comparative sail areas).


No this is very different to a Vago, think more baby RS Venture. 

Never seen a Venture Riki to be fair (I shall be swinging by the RS stand on Saturday though) but we do use Vagos at my local club for teenage kids and young adult training. Seems a good fit (hence my assumption that the Quest would be similar as the Sea Cadets take kids from age 13 upwards).

Certainly a step up from what I sailed when I was a Sea Cadet many many years ago.....
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Posts: 71 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Riki @ RS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 15 at 5:25pm
Originally posted by jeffers


Looks like a direct competitor for the Vago to me (but not sure on the comparative sail areas).


No this is very different to a Vago, think more baby RS Venture. 
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