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Ozone- competitive sailing for the 21st Century |
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yellowwelly ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 May 13 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2003 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 28 Feb 14 at 9:51am |
Here's an idea, it's very rough around the edges and hopefully this thread can be used to positively crowdsource some flesh to the bones, and if there's enough interest, then I might just implement it.
a couple of house guidelines, 1) this thread isn't designed for PY bashing, feel free to whinge away on every other thread about specific class numbers and changes. 2) Without PY racing this concept is flawed, certainly in the earlier stages 3) the primary aim of this idea is inclusion, not exclusion, for popular singlehanded sailing dinghies. The concept could, imho, be transferred to other categories of dinghies, however this is not the focus of this specific thread. The Proposal - Ozone Sailing Ozone Sailing... it's not a class association, it's more like a club. A club or community rather, promoting racing on a first across the line basis- racing scratch for a selection of unarig hiking singlehanded dinghies. The idea was formed initially by seeing the developments of the Devoti Zero and RS Aero. They both look like great new boats, more or less similar in top line spec and will probably be of similar performance characteristics. The person who sails either boat best will probably be the person who cross the line first. So why not race them together, free from biases and debates of a PY system? And while we think about it, why can't the Rooster 8.1 Laser derivative join in, and the OK, and why not the Supernova? More the merrier - racing scratch. Well that's unlikely to happen- firstly both classes will rightly try to develop a programme of class racing for their new customers, and the Supernova and OK already have established programmes. This is good, class racing is good and I welcome both developing successful circuit events for class racing. Ozone Sailing would NOT want to compete with these class programmes forming an 'alternative circuit' of new events. There's not enough resource, time and desire to go around as it is. So this leaves us with various handicap regattas- great, but their handicap regattas aren't they? Handicap Racing - a positive contribution to dinghy sailing So let's deal with this, I don't believe I am alone in finding the handicap debates in club bars, dinghy parks and in magazines and social media tiresome. Buying newer designs you are susceptible to it even more. I bought a Solo to avoid it. I see others year on year, frustrated that their handicap drops because those with 10 grand to spend buy an essentially different boat to them, albeit under the auspices of a class association. While there are others who struggle with the concepts around PY- and it's understandable at the human level, how can the boat suddenly be faster than it was last year? Does it mean that those good race memories from last season were formed under false pretences? No, it's just statistics, but statistics are devoid of emotion, we are not. However handicap PY racing is still the backstay to a lot of competitive dinghy sailing in the UK, certainly at club level. It is without question fairer than it has ever been in my living memory, and those who really make it happen do so voluntarily, providing a system that in my opinion, is far superior than something derived via boat design variables and complex algorithms. I do not believe there is any ill-intent or commercial bias or influence on the PY process, it services the majority of sailors well. If they didn't like it, they'd buy a Laser or Solo instead, or take up golf. But some, me included, find it unsatisfactory, somehow devaluing the process of the competitive sailing that has just happened on the water - racing scratch, devalued by an artificial set of results that have no real-time bearing on the race we thought we'd just enjoyed. So why not respect the spreadsheet for what it is, but derive the competitive value elsewhere- based on the Elapsed Time, rather than the Corrected Time. In other words, extract the results - racing scratch. And that's where Ozone Sailing comes in. It's an online repository and community for AerO, ZerO, OK, RoOster 8.1 and SupernOva sailors which has a several events selected from the existing dinghy racing calendar and the results are re-calculated monday morning from the elapsed time. - we do not set about creating a new (and likely to flop) series of separate events. With respect, I cite TASA. - we do not risk flushing the baby out with the bathwater, PY racing provides one framework to value your racing by statistical analysis, Ozone provides another based on what happens on the water boat-on-boat. All running on the same infrastructure and events programme with mutual respect for each other- hopefully adding boats to the start line, which is what really matters most. - we are wholly independent and inclusive. Personally I would like to welcome some expertise to create a bOx rule for independent builders and homebuilders to join in. I would personally have no problem someone joining in with a Laser either, they could even use a replica sail... but let's be fair, a Laser should be slower shouldn't it? I'm sure I've missed other classes who could slot in too... fire away, down the line a technical team would assess the merits of entry to Ozone Sailing- not something I'm skilled enough to do myself. - we could notionally even run a National & Inland Championship, and whilst I have some ideas around that there are some people I need to speak with first before I could venture that idea in the public domain. But even so, Sailfest would do as an alternative and many of you guys may well prefer that anyway once I announce my idea of something totally 'alternative'. So that's the bones of the idea- fundamentally the Ozone is to encourage lighthearted competitive sailing between new friends and old. It is not trying to 'breakdown' any established classes or handicap racing structure, rather it is aimed at providing an informal and complementary harmonising layer to the current racing we all enjoy- based on racing scratch first across the line. So what are your thoughts? Positive critique welcome. Identify barriers or just say it sucks. It won't cost much other than time and a bit of web dev. The whole thing could be run from Facebook... but that would be selling it short imho. Let's hear it.. Edited by yellowwelly - 28 Feb 14 at 10:55am |
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winging it ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 22 Mar 07 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3958 |
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D0 ?
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the same, but different...
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Noah ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 29 Dec 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 611 |
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James - nice idea, but on paper at least OK is slower than Laser so it will be outclassed in company with the D0 & Aero (unless a certain Mr Craig is sailing it
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Nick
D-Zero 316 |
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yellowwelly ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 May 13 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2003 |
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I'll be honest, the reason for the OK inclusion is because I've always liked them.
If giving someone who's just bought one of those lovely new Synergy Marine ones a further outlet to go sailing is something they want, why wouldn't 'we' be cool about it? Secondly if someone with an older one just wants to come along for the craic, then again, why the hell not? More the merrier... As for other hiking double handers... yep, but I know far less about them to even offer a suggestion for who, what and where.
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Rupert ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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Grad, Firefly, Miracle, Comet Versa are all pretty similar, though the new main on the Grad might be a bit of a boost.
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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yellowwelly ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 May 13 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2003 |
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So what do you think of the concept Rupert? You enjoy your handicap racing, but would a second set of results based on across the line finish positions, be of interest- given a restricted competitor set of 'like' boats?
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iGRF ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6499 |
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Well having spent a lifetime doing nothing else but race boards of all manner shape and size scratch, I know it can work, but...
Knowing also the dinghy mentality and experiencing what actually exists, I think it would be tough to change them, I know for example that just having the Streaker and the Solo on the same handicap now is going to cause irritation, so two boats that could go scratch against each other, but don't want to. Our wednesday afternoon club (Laser, Supernova, Eps) seem to get on OK, but that's only because I choose not to look at the results after and take my pleasure from what happens on the water overall, but that's my mentality coming from years of nothing else. Funny I was thinking about this last night based on something you'd said earlier about creating 'Boxes' and if they outsailed one 'box' they'd get moved into the next one up. Interesting idea though. |
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Rupert ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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My racing on the water is always based on the boats around me - for instance, if I can creep a minute ahead of the singlehanded Versa in about 50 minutes when Lightning sailing, then I know I have beaten him. This year I guess it will be about 30 seconds, mind. If we were racing scratch, then even with boats only a few seconds apart on handicap, I wouldn't feel like a winner unless I was clear ahead.
Having said that, I do like the idea. Years ago, when Fast Sail was about, I thought a Slow sail version, with all the numerically smaller singlehanded boats of 11 or 12 feet would be fun. With the Comet, the Lightning, the Europe, the BM, and numerous other, I thought a system of 2 scratch bandings could make a fun weekend of sailing. Expand that to 4 bandings to fit in the longer boats you are talking about and maybe each group would get critical mass at larger clubs and handicap events. |
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Medway Maniac ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 13 May 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2788 |
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Even on the same PY's, I think the brighter sparks would be able to guess Class A would win in this weather, Class B in another.
Then again, it was pretty much like that in the old days between the Buzz and the L3k. Buzz in light airs, L3k once trapezing, but it wasn't impossible to buck the system by sailing really well on the day, which is nice when it happens, so yes. there are possibilities. That said, looking at the spread of PY's in our h'cap fleets, we'd have pretty low numbers in each 'box'. Not such fun unless you like match racing.
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yellowwelly ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 May 13 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2003 |
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yes- that's definitely a consideration. There is no intention for this to 'wipe out' PY racing... smaller clubs struggle to get enough boats on the water to justify any racing at all, larger ones too in some places! Maybe down the line, if this is successful, then some clubs might adopt it, or something similar. And Graeme's right, bumping a class up or down, would also be possible. But these are all things to consider way down the line... At the moment I would concentrate on maybe 2 or 3 events per month max, ones that are already on the national calendar, and where the organising authority are willing, receive copies of the Elapsted Time data and extract out 'Ozone Sailors' and produce a new set of results for the Ozone Sailing community. The 'official results' would of course remain the PY spreadsheet traditionally sent in to Y&Y etc. Who knows, in due course, there could be some events / clubs who run events solely on the Ozone basis, but I think that's a long way off and not something to consider just yet.
Edited by yellowwelly - 28 Feb 14 at 1:05pm |
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