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Olympic Classes

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Post Options Post Options   Quote hurricane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Olympic Classes
    Posted: 08 Nov 04 at 6:17pm

Originally posted by gordon

 Neither the Finn, nor the Star nor the Tornado are present in any great numbers in the UK, is this a reason for eliminating them from the Olympics.

the tornado fleet may not match the size of the of the laser fleet but it is growing all the time and at the cost of running a tornado the size of the fleet is quite respectable!!

and the bit about replacing the tornado is utterly stupid as it has only just had its first olympics, it is still the quickest cat out there and to replace it would cost the sailors so much money that they have spent buying boats!!

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Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Nov 04 at 8:49am

While not exactly a radical rethink of Olympic sailing, the list contains some interesting suggestions.

Choosing the Snipe as the Open dinghy would be a bold choice. Outside the Olympic classes it is one of the most widely distributed dinghy classes, and is built in good numbers. The racing is incredibly close as there is little or no speed difference. The boat tolerates a  wide range of crew weights (115-150kg). Most importantly of all, it is one of the few truly international classes in which men and women compete together at the very highest level - at the moment more women crew than helm but that might change. Final advantage - the relatively comfortable hiking position means that the age range at an international level is very large. 

The Snipe's hull may date from 1931 but the rig is ultra-modern, very bendy and adjustable. Boats are quite cheap (except the Devoti's) and last for years. Not the most "sexy" dinghy (more an ultralight keelboat) but for truly mixed highly tactical fleet racing ther could be few other choices.

 

There are Snipe fleets in Britain - including the Orkneys fleet - which seems to have been based on boats left after WWII by the American navy - but there has been a recent revival.

 

I can't see the Soling or the Yngling replacing the Star - with a limit of 400 competitors no-one is seriously going to consider a 3 man boat. and choosing the Yngling would mean that the sailing world is once again excluding the heavyweights.

 

The Laser would be better as the so-called Open singlehander - how many women sail Finns!

 

Gordon
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Jon Emmett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Nov 04 at 7:09am

Well it will all be decided this week!!!


The meetings of the ISAF Council on 12 and 13 November,  will finally
decide the equipment to be used in four years’ time.

Following the Council mid-year meetings in June 2004, ISAF reduced the
choice of equipment which can be considered for selection for the 2008
Olympic Games, to the following list:

1. Multihull Open: Hobie 16 or Tornado
2. Keelboat Women: Soling or Yngling
3. Keelboat Men: Soling, Star or Yngling
4. Double-handed Dinghy Open: 49er or Snipe
5. Double-handed Dinghy Women: 470 or 49er or Snipe
6. Double-handed Dinghy Men: 470 or 49er [whichever loses vote 4], Snipe
7. Single-handed Dinghy Men: Finn or Laser [whichever is not selected is
the only option in vote 8]
8. Single-handed Dinghy Open: Finn or Laser
9. Single-handed Dinghy Women: Byte or Europe or Flash or Laser Radial or
Zoom8
10. Windsurfer Men: Hybrid, Mistral, Mistral Derivative or Outcome of
Windsurfing Equipment Evaluation Trials
11. Windsurfer Women: Hybrid, Mistral, Mistral Derivative or outcome
windsurfing equipment evaluation trials

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Contender443 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender443 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 04 at 10:33pm

Are we agreed then that weight devisions may be more realistic then. What you need is a way of finding the minimum number of classes that will be able to carry the weight.

What's wrong with Lasers with different sizes of rig or Musto Skiffs with different width wings and different rigs - that should equal the playing field.

Bonnie Lass Contender 1764
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Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 04 at 7:24pm

An Olympic class does not have to represent sailors in any one country, but must provide top quality international racing for the world's elite. Neither the Finn, nor the Star nor the Tornado are present in any great numbers in the UK, is this a reason for eliminating them from the Olympics.

Weight categories are a difficult issue.

I would strongly contest that a class with a lower weight limit of 80 kg in any way represents a heavyweight class Especially as the average size of sportsmen and women is steadily increasing. 80kg is the weight of an international scrum half nowadays!

An upper weight limit of 60kg might well exclude many women from the lightweight competition

I would be surprised if any a hull (even with different rigs) that can provide top quality racing for such differing weights. The Laser certainly doesn't cope with heavy helmsmen.

However I do agree that sailing, as with equestrian events should try and propose a number of truly Open classes in which men and women compete equally. After all it is weight, not gender, that is the significant factor in sailing. The present positive discrimination in favour of women's classes should be only a temporary mesure.

 

Gordon

 

Gordon
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Post Options Post Options   Quote hurricane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 04 at 6:05pm
very good harry your learning!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Harry44981! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 04 at 5:56pm
more catchy... in my opinion
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Harry44981! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 04 at 5:55pm

That'd be weird, with no true champ over all weight.

A little of the subject i know but.. Contender 443 you should change your footnote to ''don't hike, go trapeze... i'm hooked!''

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender443 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 04 at 5:01pm
Originally posted by gordon

The Finn is still the only real international class for singlehanded heavy weights.

The Finn does not represent sailing in the UK - does it?

I think a good idea would be to have one class and have 3 medal groups for each sex for the single handers. This could then be replicated for double handers and cats.

So you could have

Laser under 60kg Male and Female

Laser 60 to 80kg Male and Female

Laser 80kg+ Male and Female

You don't have to use the laser , you could use a new class like the Musto Skiff. You just need to make it international. Just look how quickly they did that for the 49er.

this would be easier to understand than the current system.

 

Bonnie Lass Contender 1764
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Lucy Lee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 04 at 4:06pm
Originally posted by gordon

For a truly Open (male and female) high performance two-hander for lightweights why not look at the Cherub? This would also allow the architects to have some fun at the Olympics as well.

I'll second that, not that I am in any way biased

 

Fly Cherub!
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