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Classes fading in popularity

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Mark Jardine View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mark Jardine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Classes fading in popularity
    Posted: 22 Jun 05 at 2:21pm

The national championships table is progressing nicely this year and so far seems to be showing a general increase in numbers. Great turnouts in the Mirror & Squib nationals and the Contender, Feva, Blaze & Hurricane 5.9s all in the 50+ club. If this trend continues we are going to be looking at a new record for total boats attending a nationals?

The whole SMOD vs. non-SMOD debate seems a bit irrelevant to me. People will sail what they want to sail. As long as a class has a good size fleet then it doesn't matter what they sail as long as they enjoy it. With such high attendances there is definitely room in the market for most of these designs.

Out of the 21 nationals results so far in,  6 decreased in numbers, 11 have increased in numbers, 2 haven't changed and 2 I don't have the figures for 2004.

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Jack Sparrow View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Jack Sparrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 05 at 3:57pm
Very diplomatic Mark.   
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Post Options Post Options   Quote hurricane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 05 at 10:15pm

With regards to a class that was labeled as fading the Hurricane 5.9 was often called a dieing class by the so called experts in the yachting press.

HOW can a class that pulls in 50 boats at a nationals (putting it up there with some of the largest dinghy classes) be labeled in this way.

One reason for the large number of boats attending is great social scene organised by the class assoc. After attending another rival classes event ending up very bored, I realised how lucky the 5.9 fleet is to have this active assoc.

lifes to short to sail slow boats!

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris Noble Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 05 at 11:33pm
well, being in the class, i think its definetly safe to say, that the moth class is growing at a fair rate again
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Post Options Post Options   Quote redback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 05 at 11:55pm
I've just seen a good example of a boat I had completely forgotten about and I thought had faded - the Jolly Boat.  At one time this was recorded as the fastest dinghy!  It looks strange by modern standards, very narrow and the mast is set well forward with a great long "tail" to the hull.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 05 at 10:58pm

Originally posted by Jack Sparrow


You don't have to make a Cherub DIY there are many v good boat
builders out there that will make you one, just like they do for Merlins,
N12's, fireballs e.t.c, e.t.c so just because you don't see many Cherubs
with gel coat on ( cos it's heavy ) doesn't mean you can't make it like that
if you want, just talk to your boat builder like thousands of other people.
aspects of sailing are convinced by it what hope have the general public?

Thousands ... I don't think it's quite that many ...

Yeah I could spec up a boat and get it built but I'd be looking at some pretty high depreciation I suspect and it's not as easy as getting a Musto Skiff off the shelf and just going sailing ...

Winders involvement has been a huge "shot in the arm" for the Merlins; if there was a Winder Cherub I may be tempted ...

Rick

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Blobby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 05 at 6:43am

So not an RMW Cherub then...

Just a question Rick - looking at the Musto Skiff website there are a lot of boats on the second hand list being sold by people saying they are have new boats on order.  Obviously it shows that people like the boats enough to stay in the class, and invest more money in staying in class, and it does keep a flow of second hand boats moving into the market, but what does it say about the longevity of the original boats and the cost of remaining competitive in this OD class? Given that the hulls are Ovington built there should obviously not be any question about the build quality so why the need to replace the boats?

Having said that, to me class success and longevity does depend almost completely on the energy and attitude of those in the class.  Being friendly and welcoming to newcomers, assisting people in learning to sail the boats well, maintaining a fun social side, keeping the class visible in Y&Y etc.  Above all though, when talking to others telling them that your class is great.  Obviously on this forum everyone likes to sell their own class and that is a good thing.  There will always be those who come up with opposite opinions but always remember, what you see as a downside is probably one of the reasons somebody else loves that class.  If one class premanently discredits another class, both eventually suffer because of the elitist / cliquey / snobbish etc. etc. attitude you portray which then tarnishes the whole class.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 05 at 9:31am
Originally posted by Blobby

So not an RMW Cherub then...

Just a question Rick - looking at the Musto Skiff website there are a lot of boats on the second hand list being sold by people saying they are have new boats on order.  Obviously it shows that people like the boats enough to stay in the class, and invest more money in staying in class, and it does keep a flow of second hand boats moving into the market, but what does it say about the longevity of the original boats and the cost of remaining competitive in this OD class? Given that the hulls are Ovington built there should obviously not be any question about the build quality so why the need to replace the boats?

Blobby, There are 3 boats for sale (one of those boats is sold) and the reason people renew their boats says that the residuals are so good that you can upgrade your boat to new for the price of a set of sails so why not ... funny how people can look for negatives.

The hulls are built by Ovi's and they last so well that the boats really hold their price. My first Musto I had for 18 months and suffered £100 depreciation. It's the cheapest (and most fun) sailing I have had in 30 years.

I don't know of any dev classes that hold their value that well and the fact that SMOD's don;t develop means they are a less risky buy than a dev class; unless it's a pants SMOD and the class implodes in which case you lose your shirt.

If the RMW Cherub proves it's self who knows ....

Rick

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Blobby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 05 at 10:00am
Originally posted by Guest#260

the residuals are so good that you can upgrade your boat to new for the price of a set of sails so why not Rick

[/QUOTE

In which case that is damn good value.

In which case that is damn good value.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Jack Sparrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 05 at 10:20am
RICK,

I think you might of got the wrong end of the stick about Winder e.t.c

What I meant to say / explain was that thousands of development class
boat purchasers use boat builders to build there boats for them, like
'Merlins' e.t.c I related this to Cherubs by saying you could use Winder if
you wanted ( or any number of other builders) to build you a Cherub. You
buy the plans and give it to a boat builder.

I then went on to say / ask:

... what the difference was, if RMW made a Cherub or another builder if
that builder makes the boat to your spec.

I reiterate: is it that RMW make SMOD's or is it just Gel coat?

Or is it that the brand values of the manufacture are becoming as
important to people as the brand of the class, ... and what that says about
you?

I prefer the personal touch of a small builder to production line
anonymity where I can spec a boat how I want it ( or build it myself ). But
there will always be people that want a big builder. The fact that
Ovingtons made N12's as a pop out boat a few years ago and P&B do now
( i might add using 'Winder' to build for them ) seems to press the right
buttons with some people that otherwise would not of bought a N12.
Mind you have to wait for five others before they do.

Is it just that people want to hand over a cheque because they a scared of
fitting out a boat?

Although this does seem odd to me that people make a distinction
between builders like this when you can get the same package from any
boat builder ( they will supply the boat, the rig and fit it out if you ask and
even tune it! ). May be it's a 'Herding' response..... or lack of confidence it
the purchasers ability to spec the right thing. After all sailing is a mind
game.

EDIT:

After re-reading this I have just realised that as a development class
owner you gain the ability to question your equipment in the round, as
well as your sailing skill / style and this enables you to make the
decisions I talk about above. Unlike SMOD's where the boat is a given. A
SMOD is almost an arbitrary racing machine of a given power rating. All
you have to do is concentrate on competing. And for some this is what
they want, but for a hole heap of others, they want a more rounded
competition experience that challenges there technical ( mental ) and
physical abilities.

Crouched waiting for a barrage of SMOD owner Mr Angry postings


Edited by Jack Sparrow
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