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Helz View Drop Down
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Posts: 96 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Helz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Olympic Classes
    Posted: 10 Mar 07 at 4:49pm

I myself don't sail a topper or an Oppie. Oppies are bath tubs with sails. No I sail a laser - not just the 4.7 and often sail trapeze boats.

Vagos are not unrefined they r sexual (C Question for definition) They are imence for racing in and the trapezing is brilliant.

True about the pourer nations not necisarily affording the moths - however on the point of cost how do poorer nations afford the lasers, the Fins the Yinglings (Or howeva u spell it???)
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49erGBR735HSC View Drop Down
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Posts: 1991 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 49erGBR735HSC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 07 at 4:58pm

Vagos are unrefined, the hulls are flexible, the rigs undeveloped and by all accounts they are pretty heavy too. There are so many racing boats which I could list which are more refined and better to sail than Vagos, although the Vago was targetted more at sailing school audiences. Vagos do what their designed to do well, but I'd never classify them as highly refined racing boats.

As for Olympic classes, I can't comment on windsurfing as I don't have too much knowledge of it but the way I'd list it would be;

49er Open

Laser Mens

Laser Radial Female

Tornado Open

MPS Open

470 Open

Female Double handed skiff (possibly open instead of female but for lightweights)

Position for a proposed sport boat through ISAF- SB3, J80 or any other viable alternative. 



Edited by 49erGBR735HSC
Dennis Watson 49er GBR735
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Harry44981! View Drop Down
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Posts: 736 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Harry44981! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 07 at 5:07pm
I agree with Dennis.

RE: poorere nations. Lasers are very cheap relatively- a one of payement (with the frequent new sail) of £4000 for a boat that can win the Olympics, with no need to spend money on testing rigs or sails. How do poorer nations afford the Ynglings or Finns? They don't.

There are lots of far superior (in terms of speed, refinement etc.) single trapeeze boats than the Vago. Eg: 470. I'm not sure about the Vago being "sexual"

By the way I wasn't "having a go" at you by suggesting the Oppie for your weight- it's just the boat you are closet to the optimum weight for.
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Posts: 539 		Post Options Post Options   Quote CurlyBen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 07 at 5:09pm
Originally posted by 49erGBR735HSC

Vagos do what their designed to do well

In my experience I wouldn't even entirely agree with that. I had the rudder break off when sailing in a F5 or so and know of another boat which had a similar issue. The idea of singlehanding it without the jib I've also found to be a bit of a non starter. The rig is a tree trunk! This is apparently because it's designed to be used with little rig tension (the hull can't take lots) and so the whole lot can move instead. They are certainly fairly weighty, thought considering the weight of my boat I can't complain too much! I wouldn't even agree on the trapezing being particularly good, being an oversize washing up bowl it's pretty slippy. I'd agree with Dennis, there's plenty of other boats that are far, far better than the Vago for racing.
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les5269 View Drop Down
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Posts: 1530 		Post Options Post Options   Quote les5269 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 07 at 5:12pm
Originally posted by Helz

There were no reason for my choices other than:

  1. Topper - Get more light weight people into Olympic sailing. It doesn't seem fair to me that nearly every sailor at the Olympics is like over 8 stone - I probably only think that because I am only 5.5 stone myself.
  2. Vago - pretty cool boat. Fun for trapezing on and I think they are a good boat for mixed sex helm and crew.
  3. Moth - Basically they are a totally aw some boat when they are flying. It would help persuade more people in our great nation to sail when they see how much fun can be had from the sport.

Does anyone agree with me now???

 

Just a few questions to clarify your reasoning here ;

1) What planet do you live on ? I ask this because you must live on the moon or something to think anyone is going to agree to these classes

2) THE TOPPER ????  I really have nothing to add to that !

3) The Vago ? God they are awful boats and you want to make our best sailors in the world look complete pratts sailing them 

4) The Moth ? Well at least you picked one decent boat out of the 3 but it's a development class how are the Olympics going to keep up with the boat ?

 

I'm not being harsh on you Helz but the classes are not up to any Olympic standards at all!

 



Edited by les5269
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Prince Buster View Drop Down
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Posts: 1146 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Prince Buster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 07 at 6:14pm
Helz you are yet young and have a lot to learn but you will be eaten alive if you carry on making suggestions like that!!
Let's blame is upon the folley of youth!
The topper as an Olympic class would be an insult to the sailing world.
Les is right about the Vago - they are heavy and underpowered and look very ungainly.  Just out of interest is the Vago the only trapeze boat you've ever sailed?

Helen if I were you I wouldn't dis the oppie too much.  Personally I think you'd be far better off getting good quality national racing in one until you get a but bigger.  At a lot of open meetings on the sea you have to be over 50kg to race a 4.7 and even on a pond you're going to be blown away in any competition above a F3!
international moth - "what what?"
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Villan View Drop Down
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Posts: 1768 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Villan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 07 at 6:43pm
Originally posted by Helz

There were no reason for my choices other than:

  1. Topper - Get more light weight people into olympic sailing. It doesn't seem fair to me that nearly every sailor at the olympics is like over 8 stone - I proberly only think that because I am only 5.5 stone myself.


Any adult that weighs under 8 stone is unhealthy. 

Go hit the curries and kebabs for a year, and dont do quite as much excercise. Its not the healthiest way of putting on weight, but it works!
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foaminatthedeck View Drop Down
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Posts: 318 		Post Options Post Options   Quote foaminatthedeck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 07 at 7:29pm
I'm just not sure that we would be doing any one a favour if we introduced a <8st boat all that would be developed by doing that would be a class that could only be compeated in by 15 year old girls (a bit like gymnastics)or posh spice. Having never been a 15 year old girl I can't comment for them but when I was 15 I'm pritty sure that I wasn't sail at the top level!
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49erGBR735HSC View Drop Down
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Posts: 1991 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 49erGBR735HSC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 07 at 8:10pm
It's quite easy to get dismissive of Olympic classes and start wondering why some boats get all the focus. For a while I used to question the selection of the 470, wondering why something like the 505, Laser 2 etc hadn't been selected instead as I had heard all the stories about the class being elitist, boats being no good after a season, etc, etc. Then I sailed one and could see all the plus points of it, enjoyed the experience completely and was quite close to joining the class. A boat which I viewed as elitist and poor value suddenly had a lot of respect from me as it was well balanced and light yet powerful.  I've sailed the Tornado also and came off the water grinning cheek from cheek, if not somewhat petrified after having a Force 6 baptism of fire. With what I've experienced with those classes, I feel from my point of view and the enjoyment I had from those boats, they deserve their positions. I sail the 49er because I feel its the best boat I've sailed, the Tornado coming a very close second and therefore the classes will always have my support and admiration.
Dennis Watson 49er GBR735
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Helz View Drop Down
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Posts: 96 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Helz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Mar 07 at 10:31am

Ok, I no people a lot over 8 stone who sail toppers at the highest level and most of them are in the mid to late twenties and quite tall, they just work on their agility. Topper sailing is a slightly different sport to most boats, if u are tall you have to work your agility and flexibility so much more.

No the vago isn't the only trapeze boat I have sailed. I have also sailed: The 3000, Fireball and I sailed a 29er once.
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