What boat ... ??

   Here goes ... situation ...

Me 47 fit and active (I think) ... three sons 14, 13 & 11.  Experiance ... I used to own a mirror some 20 yrs ago & then turned to wndsurfing which is still lying dormant in the garage after some 14 years of non-use.  Two eldest sons have been on weeks water courses and really enjoyed the sailing aspects ... eldest going single handed and obviously loving it.

Boat ... towable ... handled by me and 14 yr old ... appreciating they need to start somewhere but looking for a boat that will live with us for a while good in light winds but the spectrum including extreme (if thats possible) crewed by 2 adults, maybe 1 adult two kids (but not essential).  Have been looking at the Vago but reading some of the comments on the forums started to doubt myself.

Any help would be appreciated pointing me in the right direction realising people must have their preferences.

Thank you

Alan

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Noobie Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Newbie Joined: 09 Apr 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3	Post Options Post Reply Quote Noobie Report Post Quote Reply Topic: What boat ... ?? Posted: 09 Apr 07 at 10:06am
	Here goes ... situation ... Me 47 fit and active (I think) ... three sons 14, 13 & 11. Experiance ... I used to own a mirror some 20 yrs ago & then turned to wndsurfing which is still lying dormant in the garage after some 14 years of non-use. Two eldest sons have been on weeks water courses and really enjoyed the sailing aspects ... eldest going single handed and obviously loving it. Boat ... towable ... handled by me and 14 yr old ... appreciating they need to start somewhere but looking for a boat that will live with us for a while good in light winds but the spectrum including extreme (if thats possible) crewed by 2 adults, maybe 1 adult two kids (but not essential). Have been looking at the Vago but reading some of the comments on the forums started to doubt myself. Any help would be appreciated pointing me in the right direction realising people must have their preferences. Thank you Alan
	Noobie requiring good advice : )

jeffers Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 29 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3048	Post Options Post Reply Quote jeffers Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 09 Apr 07 at 11:57am
	Alan, I would take a L2000 over a Vago, not sure what the light wind performance in one is like though having only ever crewed in one when it is blowing dogs off chains! I believe the Vago weighs something like 270 or KG (which is more than a Wayfarer which IMO is a much better boat). The othr thing with the L2K is that you can (if you want to) get a trapeze kit and lowers which will allow for trapeze training. The other thing you may want to consider is something like a Fireball. People may laugh but they are acutally quite stable or perhaps a Scorpion both pretty good in the light stuff, advantage of a proper kite and both tunable according to conditions (especially the Scorp when fitted with a raking rig). Just my 2p as always....
	Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74

Lukepiewalker Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 24 May 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1341	Post Options Post Reply Quote Lukepiewalker Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 09 Apr 07 at 1:42pm
	Try a GP14. Plenty of cockpit space, decent lightwind performance, not the lightest boat in the world but will sail in pretty much any weather you throw at it. Widely available in different materials with double floors on the more recent boats. Ken 8~)

Medway Maniac Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 13 May 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2788	Post Options Post Reply Quote Medway Maniac Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 09 Apr 07 at 8:27pm
	Take a look at this report of the last 3000 nationals, incl. the photos: http://www.3000class.org.uk/forum/content.asp?GET_ID=727 A lot of the teams were parent-teenager. The boat is easy to sail, doesn't require a great deal of weight but, being low to the water gives a good dose of excitement. Browse under 'All Forums' or go to the home page for more info on the class - we're small but friendly.

NickA Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 30 Mar 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 784	Post Options Post Reply Quote NickA Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 09 Apr 07 at 9:33pm
	Sails 3 up and good in light winds? Thames A-rater obviously! But seriously ... L2000s are pretty good in light winds, lots of momentum and comfy seats. Also work in huge winds due to solid construction and reefable sails. Quite spacious, v. popular with couples and hold their price well too. Stratos = same but bigger and pricier. But ... expensive for what you get, heavy and not exactly the scintillating performance desired by most teenagers. The dad / son pairings at our club have disolved into either dad and son in separate boats or dad and son getting an RS800 - leaving mum in the coffee shop probably! But they did have fun for a while. Performance wise, much the same's true of GP14s, wayfarers etc. Bit dull. Vago? erm no. It has its merits but there are better boats around (see above). Poor in light winds and 3 up is a no go - believe me I've tried it; too many trip hazards and a guaranteed swim. Compact 2 person trapeze boats do tend to be a little cramped! Personally, faced with a situation similar to your own, I've ended up with three boats to cover all eventuallities; one of which is the aforementioned 3000 - but for which you mustn't mind getting very wet as it has almost no freeboard. Maybe a L2000 for a few years, but expect to trade it in. Edited by NickA
	Javelin 558 Contender 2574

Hobbo Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 02 Jun 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 211	Post Options Post Reply Quote Hobbo Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 07 at 12:14am
	Depending on your size you may want to look at an Osprey (or on budget second hand 505/Javelin too). Boat tows very nicely if on right trailer despite size. Sailabale by father and son, several teams like that in the class, including a 12 y.o. and his dad (not big people) third to windward mark in one race at the nats. Reasonable performance in lightwinds, more comfortable than some smaller dinghies. Can be managed in higher winds, especially with adjustale rig to remove power. Easily enough room for three and allowed to be raced either two or three up by class rules and handles the weight comfortably, a lighter team came 9th at the nats sailing three up. All the fun of the trapeze of the Vago but performs SO much better than a Vago as well as being more comfortable. Added challenge of the symmetrical kite which is more practical on many club courses and which you may be used to from your mirror days. Superbly quick on a 3 sail reach. Thats my very biased two pennies worth .
	Contender GBR 362 Osprey 1318 - IVplay SSC

Pierre Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 15 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1532	Post Options Post Reply Quote Pierre Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 07 at 10:16am
	All my boys learned to trapeze on my Osprey, the youngest when he was 9. Great fun, quick, will handle any size people, any time, any place, any where. The two eldest are now around 6' 3" and have no probs with the occaissional blat round when they are back from Uni. The youngest, now 14, is now far better at sailing than me, but still deigns to come out for the odd zap round. (Also older women often comment about what a good looking boat it is. ) Another biased opinion for your consideration.

Noobie Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Newbie Joined: 09 Apr 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3	Post Options Post Reply Quote Noobie Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 07 at 10:58am
	Thanks for all the posts certainly makes interesting reading .... just to add to the debate any thoughts on either the RS200 or RS Feva are they totally more advanced for two persons ... i.e. don't run before you can walk ... ?? From the posts the L2000 seems to be the general opinion ... its just that it looks so big for two people (have to excuse my ignorance) and I believe whatever the family say now about all wanting to be in the boat it will inevitably be two of us and more than likely one adult & one child, Cathrine walking the dog! The statement "maybe a L2000 for a few years, but expect to trade it in" concerns me. Alan PS as above please excuse any comments that seem daft I'm in the market for a boat and its a few years since I've taken a look at whats out there (20+) !!!
	Noobie requiring good advice : )

Graham T Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Posting king Joined: 09 Apr 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 123	Post Options Post Reply Quote Graham T Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 07 at 11:00am
	My Kids (8 & 11) love sailing in the Osprey but it is a handful in any real wind with an 8 year old trying to sheet in a huge genoa. We also find there is too much string in the front end to have them both crewing at the same time (a Mk IV is better in this respect). It is also a real weight to pull up the slip with a tired child after sailing! What we use for family sailing is a Miracle - light, faster than a mirror with more space (we have raced this 4 up!), great fun in a blow as you are so near the water you hike out in your own bow wave and in light airs I have sailed past Ospreys in it! The greatest asset is that I can send them to get changed and pull the boat up the slip on my own with no problems when they are cold and wet. It is easy for them to sail on their own as well so I can get out in the Osprey with the Mrs.... You really need at least two boats!

Noobie Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Newbie Joined: 09 Apr 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3	Post Options Post Reply Quote Noobie Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 07 at 11:18am
	Need two boats !!!!! the wife would love that ... NickA having three ... must admit Osprey also sounds interesting ... I'll have a trawl around a few sites ... Alan
	Noobie requiring good advice : )