RS500 ...

Originally posted by Stefan Lloyd If you are buying a racing boat, you are buying into a class and you want others to do the same. It's more like buying a fax machine; pretty useless if you own the only one. The economists have a term for this kind of product whose value increases as more people buy it: they talk about network effects and Metcalf's law. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_effect

Stefan,

I worked with Bob Metcalf during my 6 years at 3Com and I don't think his "law" was really applicable in this situation but I think you are making a valid point.

People want a boat they enjoy AND in most cases a boat they can race - which means you need others. We need fleets to enjoy our sailing.

The thing I would be worried about if I worked at LDC is all the general negative vibe towards LDC shown on this forum - they will no doubt sell 40 boats off the stand at Excel but the market perception of the company is not healthy if this forum is any indication.

Rick

No, that's not all that needs to be said.

If you are buying say, a car, that is an individual decision. It doesn't really matter to you if 1000 or 100,000 people buy the same model. You might well like something exclusive.

If you are buying a racing boat, you are buying into a class and you want others to do the same. It's more like buying a fax machine; pretty useless if you own the only one. The economists have a term for this kind of product whose value increases as more people buy it: they talk about network effects and Metcalf's law. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_effect

The proliferation of classes changes sailing for everyone. Those clubs still running "adopted class only" policies come under increasing pressure to allow in new classes. Class racing is under pressure at some clubs and pretty much gone at others. Equally, nobody would dispute that good new classes emerge amongst the quickly-forgotten ones.

Whether you let market forces prevail, as most but not all clubs in the UK do, or whether you strongly steer sailors to established classes, as seems to happen in much of mainland Europe and some clubs here, is a decision that has big effects on the way the sport develops. It's a subject that needs to be discussed.

I'm not saying I know the answers one way or another. My point is just that there is more to it than "consumer choice".

Edited by Stefan Lloyd

This must be the cheapest focus group LDC ever got to show them there was no point in actually launching a new build.

They sniffed a gap in the market, but there is no market in the gap!

We have a pile of reasonable performance 'semi displacement' boats in this category- the laser offerings, the buzz ,the Chrub,  the ISO and all the symmetrical classes.

If you want true modern, higher performance which takes you to the future of sailing and the current olympic 'pinacle' 49er then there is a nice little package for teenagers at around 2 grand less than what LDC want to sell anything for.- 29er.

It isn't a tough boat to sail. It does need finesse and a new approach to sailing which fits in with a certain thing called PROGRESS!!

LDC will come up against a wall of 'lightly used' second hand single trap boats suitable for average teenagers who have been put off by the elitist 29er image - which is a by product of having such a narrow 'squad' pyramid mentality in the RYA

The real big gap in the market is for heavier sailors. We are left out of most all of the production skiff and semi displacement racers and left with the Finn, FD or 505. The 59er fits the bill in terms of moving to a high performance category of sailing in our usual winds, but it has been appaullingly marketed as an old, fat duffers boat and priced too high to make in roads

A V3000 prototype is racing at my club.  The boat is significantly faster than the L3000 in any sort of breeze although the helm claims he thinks its not as good in the light stuff.  The helm is very good but this doesn't explain completely why the V3000 is embarassing the 4000s - it has to be the boat, particularly the lighter hull.

The helm claims the boat is still under development and so may not turn out quite so fast.  That will be up to the class association - they may have a dilema.  Slow it down so that it stays comparable with the L3000 or leave it like it is, which may give it a yardstick under 1000 and then it will have a nice ciche in the market rather than being a competitor to the Buzz.

We'll have to se how it performs in the light but in any breeze its way faster than a Buzz.

 

Edited by redback

The V3000 is a Laser 3000 with a lot of sensible developments from skiffs, ie boom sheeting, RS800 style chute at the front, new Sobstad sails, vang kicker, better control lines and has lost about 30kg. Looks a pretty sorted boat and the old 3000s can mod up to the new developments although I think it will be hard to lose the 30kgs.

Edited by 49erGBR735HSC