Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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List classes of boat for sale |
Pointing |
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jeffers ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 29 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3048 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 08 Sep 05 at 8:15pm |
Just to add it is down to personal style.
In a breeze (we are talking Lasers here) I tend to go for the pointing and keeping the boat flat (don't be afraid to use cunningham in blow, I think it is the most under used sail control). In the mid range it's a case of keeping the boat moving and flat (remember flat is fast, if you heel you tend to slip sideways). In the light stuff (where I tend to lose out being a a porker at my club at 13st) I tend to sail with the sails fairly flat (to keep the wind flwoing) and sailing free. So although I may point 5 to 10 degrees lower I sail that much quicker it makes up for the extra distance. Just my 2p.....it must work for me though having won 2 out of 3 series so far this year. Regards, Paul |
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Paul
---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
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redback ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Mar 04 Location: Tunbridge Wells Online Status: Offline Posts: 1502 |
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Here's my 2p worth. In boats like the Laser it pays to stuff in the gusts, but in faster boats (say PY less than 925) it gets more complicated. Below a certain windspeed you still stuff in the gusts because the added speed is not enough to compensate for the extra distance of sailing lower. However above a certain windspeed its faster to switch to driving in the gusts. You certainly sail lower than those that stuff but you sail so much faster and you find yourself luffing in the lulls. Your crew must be aware of this method because he's going to need to be more energetic. When you luff in the lulls he may have to come in off the trapeze but in the gusts you are deliberately going to power off so he must be out there before the boat heels. The helm too has to work harder, that mainsheet will be drawn in as you luff in the lulls and may then have to be eased as the boat loses speed. In the puffs it must be eased instantly to keep the boat flat and then drawn in as the boat speed is established. The leach is highly loaded during this phase and the mainsheet will be heavy. I find the rig needs to be correctlyset for this style. It doesn't work if the rig is not able to flex in the gusts. So on my boat I could have more power by tightening the lowers but then I find it staggers in the gusts rather than accelerates (its pretty subtle but with experience it is noticeable). A little bit of mast bend and flexibility helps the boat naturally open its leach in the gusts and provides a transition which gives the crew time to get in and out and keep the boat flat. |
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Guest ![]() Newbie ![]() Joined: 21 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 0 |
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That is a good point ... it takes for fitness and strength to be a good footer ... that's another reason why I prefer to sail high.
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Calum_Reid ![]() Groupie ![]() ![]() Joined: 09 Apr 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 59 |
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We used to be what has been described as stuffers in the 400 but we were once left for dead when it was windy and there was big waves so we now sail lower (footed off) as soon as we can hike. When it's windy, on both flat water and in big waves we can foot off along was and so long as your boat is flat it just goes! The other thing about not pointing is your getting your foils working and so you dont loose ground to leward if a gust comes through and also u dont dig into a wave and slow down in the same way.
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damp_freddie ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 20 Oct 05 Location: Aruba Online Status: Offline Posts: 339 |
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this is actually an excellent question for this forum, with some very well informed replies.
Here is my tuppence worth Firstly, in all boats it is important to get moving at a good pace below 'high' pointing with the wind anaywhere from abeam to just 'cracked off' This will get the centre board creating lift- vital for VMG- and it is important as you now work the boat up to the higher pointing to keep the flow attached by driving in smooth movements. Sails are easier to adjust as you maneovre, but it is easy to stall out the dagger board in the thicker stuff under the hull! Secondly we lack the instrumentation of keel boats ( thankfully! I think even tacktick should be banned but hey that's my opinion ;-) ) Many of them have a VMG display or use a table of target upwind speeds to wind stregnth stuck to the bulkhead. When boat speed is higher than optimal for a wind sttregnth, they point up using leech tension on the main and maybe trimming the job in and inward on barber hauler. Conversley if too slow, they will have a good look around and check the wind is not lower now, all else being well set. How in the name of Auld Nick do you achieve this VMG display on a dinghy? Presuming pre-upwind planing conditions or, like the heavy RS4oo, a boat which is displacement up wind. When we get the boat moving at a good lick for the conditions,it is important to get the crew weight out and optimised so the boat feels like it is falling over ontop of you! Then it is flat! Using leech tension and rudder (or lee-heel and rudder) the boat is worked up onto the wind. The VMG indicator is simple- the bow and quarter waves should leave from the ends of the boat ie the flow of the max velocity displacement is attached to the extremities of the hull (ie correct wetted area). If there is a decent wind but the qaurter wave (back most wave of the two the boat makes, ) is leaving far forward from the stern then chances are you are sailing too high- bear off using only rudder and see if the top most tell tale begins to break more or less frequently- Sail to 50-60+% 'breaking' ie going behind the sail. If converesely you are begining to escape your quarter wave and 'climb the hill' of the bow wave ie moving towards planing, then you can point higher to attach the wave to your stern area again. On a fast boat it may be time to plane upwind and even bear away to pop it onto the plane! In v.light airs you can assume that the quarter wave comes from a wetted area point far forward of the stern, given you are trimming the wieght correctly forward. This can also show good boat speed and when to go higher or lower as it increases in size or decreases. |
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Calum_Reid ![]() Groupie ![]() ![]() Joined: 09 Apr 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 59 |
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When we were out last sunday in big waves and big wind we were sailing cracked off a little and then a skwall came through and i let the jib out big style at this point it was set for reaching the boat just accelerated and didnt loose pointing at all! It was very very windy and the wind hadnt swung!!
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damp_freddie ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 20 Oct 05 Location: Aruba Online Status: Offline Posts: 339 |
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yeah, the apparent wind will go well aft. Also any boat will plane give hurricane Katrina, but a tasar will go upwind on the plane in 9 knts of breeze and a 49er in around 5 or 6. |
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49erGBR735HSC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 30 Mar 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1991 |
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Tasar??? 9 knots???
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damp_freddie ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 20 Oct 05 Location: Aruba Online Status: Offline Posts: 339 |
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The 'supernova NS14' as featured i 'High peformance sailing' is the pre-production tasar. It's polar diagram and drag curve are the first development path in the family towards the boat you sail, and probably the even slippier hull in the new 59er. 20 years of development reduced the 'bump' in the drag curve until now in tthe 9er boats it is almost linear between displacement and planing With a light crew the tasar should be pointed up to 7knts wind speed and then planed at around 9 knts! This is it's design wind and thereafter it is being depowered. It is a tricky boat to sail despite it's no trap' no spin' appearance. Bit like bass guitar. Once I sailed one at DBSC with a laser 4000 chap in a blow, 30 stone up. We walked all over the RS200s and he said it felt pretty much as fast up wind on the plane as the 4000. We could choose to duck or go high over the 200s Off wind we had better downwind VMG by running. I believe there is one doing quite well - at your home club HSC! |
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49erGBR735HSC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 30 Mar 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1991 |
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Yeah, is that Graeme's boat your talking about? I was just a little bit sceptical about a Tasar hitting the plane in 9 knots but with a light crew it could be possible. The 49er hits the plane effectively just a little bit higher than the range you quoted, unless you are at the rear of the boat which creates a lot of drag by the hull digging in and is really slow. The technique that we use is to have our weight as far forward as possible and concentrate on having the rear edge of the boat just clear or kissing the water. The boat will plane easily but you've got to be careful that she's not in bow up mode just because of where the weight is biased on the boat. If your weight is forward it promotes bow down planing which is faster than having the bow up at unecesary height. Back to the Tasars, are the newer boats still using wing masts or have they moved on to gust responsive rigs?
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