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Compulsory membership of the class assoc.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Barty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Compulsory membership of the class assoc.
    Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 4:07pm

Would it not be easy to put up club memberships by £2-3 a year and then pay the relevant associations that money for club racers.  Think how many people club race and do no more.  The associations would get hundreds of extra pounds a year that they could invest in paying coaches to go to individual clubs and give good class coaching.  This would surely encourage more people to go to opens, join the association, more funds........etc.  They could also provide a club racers association pack with tuning info etc.

Everyones a winner!!!!!

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tgruitt View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tgruitt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 3:38pm
i am a member of the cherub assn and i haven't even got a cherub, but I am involved with the class photography and sail one very now and then! I also race a laser at my club (dull i know) which i am borrowing but am not a member of the laser assn as I am never going to race the laser again becasue i hate them! so, do you think I should be a member of the laser assn becasue i club race one?
Needs to sail more...
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Ian S View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Ian S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 2:52pm

Unfortunately CA's do tend to be a bit of a circuit racers club, for the simple reason that it's the circuit racers who tend to care enough to get involved.

Generally it's a cultural thing in the clubs, it's the older, long standing sailors who seem to set the example of "there's no benefit in joining"; new sailors then take this as gospel.

At the end of the day the guy with a floating shed who sails 4 weekends a year is never going to join anything. From a club perspective he's easy money as he turns up to do his duties, and the club won't want to upset him by asking for extra money in case he leaves altogether.

Most classes do offer savings to their members, it's a hard message to get across though.  As for password protected websites.. well someone has spent the time to put it all together.. why should none members get the same advantages as members.

(As a quick aside, go to Class Training events, if you have no intention of ever doing an open you'll still learn loads about your boat, get more from sailing it and maybe clean up at your club if you pay attention and work hard.)

The RYA could have worked wonders here with the Champion Club and Charter, require a minimum percentage of regular club sailors to be CA members in order for the club to qualify. AFter all both Champion Club and the Charter are about promoting racing and observance of the rules..

Perhaps I'm just an utter fool for the amount of time and money I've poured into my CA over the years.

food for thought.

cheers

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Garry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 1:46pm
Originally posted by Ian S

So how many people here aren't members of their association and yet will still use an assocaition website to ask questions on??




That would be a good question for Mark to put up a poll on.


The Lark class allows you temporary membership for non-championship opens. How many other classes do that?

And I am a fully paid-up member of sailing club, RYA and CA. Both the RYA and CAs need to do a better job of getting the benefits message across to non members (but also need to make the benefits tangible).

I'm not sure you could get a protest thrown out because the protestor wasn't a member of the CA but in many cases (since sailing instructions normally require boats to have been measured) the lack of a valid measurement certificate could be reported to the race committee who would require one to be produced or score the boat DSQ Rule 78. But this isn't in the spritit of club racing (and a bit like using speed cameras to control speed) it might work but does not achieve the wider overall objectives.



Garry

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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 1:29pm
Originally posted by Ian S

Jim, sorry you felt aggrieved by being asked to jon the class assoc to do the 29er thing, but someone had to pay to organise it all and give up many hours of their time.. is it really that unreasonable to be asked to pay towards this?


I thought that was what the entry fee - something like 20% more than for our regular class at the same venue a few weeks earlier - was for! I'm not saying its right or wrong, just pointing out that it lost the event an entry.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote TonyL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 1:08pm
"I've also noticed an increasing number of people on the open circuit putting the RYA as their club, presumebly because the boat is kept at home and raced at opens, so there is no need to be a member of a sailing club. I would imagine that all those in this position are members of their assn, and get much from it."

Interesting point. There's definitely two types of racer out there, firstly those whose primarily loyalty is to the circuit and the class, and those whose primary loyalty is to a club. I seem to remember when I sailed Lasers ages ago (and was a member of the Laser CA) they used to run events specifically aimed at club sailers. That always struck me as a really good idea.






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Post Options Post Options   Quote Matt Jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 1:01pm

Originally posted by Garry

Biometric ID cards are obviously the solution! Some vital part of the boat is digitally recorded and placed on a chip. Cost should be less than £300 and the technology won't work, but surely this is a price worth paying for protecting the security of our class associations. What's more it will make moving boats across international borders much simplier, especially if going to the USA. Any boat unable to produce an ID card on demand will be indefinately impounded with no judicial review.

In fact this is such a good idea Tony's going to get every person in the UK scanned as well.

Don't get me started on that one!

I quite like Rick's idea about the sailing clubs collecting a coupla quid for each class represented at the club.

Maybe, as the CAs are (in general) so heavily based on racing, membership should be free but with the entry for opens being 'a coupla quid' more to cover the diffrence that way you don't need to have paid up front to race at an opens and overnight the CA's would boost their membership. Then with their huge mailing list they can go into marketting overdrive and make a bundle on directing people to their preferred chandlers who pay a % commision on anything sold.



Edited by Matt Jackson
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Ian S View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Ian S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 1:00pm

So how many people here aren't members of their association and yet will still use an assocaition website to ask questions on??

A few problems with sailing, you get sailing as a sport and sailing as a recreation, for those people who fall into the latter category they can see no need for the RYA, the CA or the RRS.

Basically these days everyone seems to want everything for free, I've known several sailors who aren't short of a bob or two who see no need for joining their association, yet when it came to selling thier boat they were both there and complaining about the fee they had to pay (members got to advertise free).

If the Enterprise assoc for example were to disappear tonight, the resale value of ents would plummet, no assoc, no organised racing = dying class

BUT we all know this, it's a matter of conscience, the saving grace is that if your class rules require membership then even at club level you cannot be protested by someone who should be a member but isn't.. licence to cheat it could be :-)

Jim, sorry you felt aggrieved by being asked to jon the class assoc to do the 29er thing, but someone had to pay to organise it all and give up many hours of their time.. is it really that unreasonable to be asked to pay towards this?

cheers

Ian

 

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Garry View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Garry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 10:27am
Biometric ID cards are obviously the solution! Some vital part of the boat is digitally recorded and placed on a chip. Cost should be less than £300 and the technology won't work, but surely this is a price worth paying for protecting the security of our class associations. What's more it will make moving boats across international borders much simplier, especially if going to the USA. Any boat unable to produce an ID card on demand will be indefinately impounded with no judicial review.

In fact this is such a good idea Tony's going to get every person in the UK scanned as well.
Garry

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 05 at 9:53am

When I was growing up sailing Fireflies at Tamesis in the 70s and 80s it was compulsory to be a CA member to race, though a lot of leeway was allowed in the time it took to sign up. As a member of Whitefriars now, where there is very little class racing, it almost all being handicap, there is no such rule. There are almost as many different types of boat out as there are people racing them. At this point, it would be far more worthwhile encouraging people to join the RYA to support the PY scheme than CAs. But that is rather tricky, too...

I've also noticed an increasing number of people on the open circuit putting the RYA as their club, presumebly because the boat is kept at home and raced at opens, so there is no need to be a member of a sailing club. I would imagine that all those in this position are members of their assn, and get much from it.

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