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Dinghy Development for the MATURE sailor

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mpl720 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mpl720 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Dinghy Development for the MATURE sailor
    Posted: 19 Jan 05 at 3:52pm

Big boys B14 then ?  Perhaps with a chute though and perhaps a centreboard to go with the armchairs (but extra strong wings !)  However the thread was looking for a single-wire big boys (alright 'persons' then) modern asymetric.

Mike L.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Granite Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jan 05 at 1:23pm
The problem with a single wire boat for the larger person is that it will always pay to have a larger crew and smaller helm because on the wire is the right place to put the weight. Making me think that racks and two hiking might be the better option
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Blobby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jan 05 at 12:54am

WHy not get the transom ballast to heave up the kite? - he can chuck the tiller extension to the crew on the wire and then heave away on the halyard.

Helms always used to do the halyard on pole kites - tell them to stop being so lazy and get on with it...

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Post Options Post Options   Quote glennhow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jan 05 at 12:48am

for an expansive comparison spread sheet check out...

http://www.contractsolutions.net/J18/jn-18_comparison.html

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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 05 at 11:07pm
Originally posted by redback

A 400 I found absolutely knackering in a breeze because its sitting out, hard, upwind and down and almost as much effort at kite hoisting.


Dunno, I jump up the sharp end of 400s regularly and its an awful lot easier to pace the old bones. I just don't straight leg hike for much beyond the first twenty yards off the startline:-). And that little baby kite seems to nip up and down in a couple of pulls.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote redback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 05 at 7:36pm

On the other hand large boats - like the Boss - respond slower than little boats and a trapeze is much gentler on the body and particularly the knees than a sitting-out boat, and to cap it all an asymmetric is a lot easier (and interesting) than a conventional kite.  So the idea of a 1 string Boss is a good one.  I've not sailed one so this is a bit of supposition.  But I do sail a 4000 and I used to crew a 400.  A 400 I found absolutely knackering in a breeze because its sitting out, hard, upwind and down and almost as much effort at kite hoisting.

The only thing that's hard work for the helm in a 4000 is righting the thing (and it does capsize easily).  I guess the Boss is going to be similar, except the carbon rig might help, but I recall the 400 was one hell of a stretch to the centre board from the water, even if it didn't capsize quite so much.

Yeah, I think there's a future in a 1 string Boss.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 05 at 6:36pm
I was having a discussion at my club this weekend on related kinda issues... When one is, shall we say, of slighly more mature years, there are other things to consider. Both of us, crewing in our respective chosen high performance boats, have found that its kite hoists and drops that really take it out of you, and because your recovery time isn't as fast as it once was then each lap makes you a bit more tired than the one before, and each day a bit more, so by the end of day three of an event you're really creaking.

The other week I dropped in to someones boat to crew, and I must have been on the tail end of a virus or something, because the performance was absolutely pathetic. OK it didn't help that the halyard turn block was broken, doubling the effort, but it was all I could do to get out on the wire by the end of the race. Most desperately awful crewing job I've turned in since I knew one end of a spinnaker pole from the other...

Obviously the age at which this kicks in varies with the amount of time you can spend in the gym and numerous other factors, but the point is that something like the Boss isn't going to be a great call for the average club sailor of more advanced years. You need to be able to catch your breath and recover! The one time I crewed a Boss (not my style of boat at all) I felt that the physical effort/performance ratio was a bit skewed towards the hard work for my taste and birth year...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mpl720 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 05 at 2:46pm

The Boss is very far from 'slouchy' offwind but unlikely to be in full 49er country but the call was for a fast modern asymetric for 'adult' sized crews.  It's also fairly long and a good weight carrier.  Can be bought for peanuts currently and are well built and light.  Class appears to be dying fast so might be a good for transformation (along with the name !) to get things going in new format.

Mike L.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Granite Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 05 at 1:31pm

A concept like that would probably be top end speed limited down wind at the top of the wind range, but in typical UK conditions 10 to 12 Kts upwind it would be verry fast.  maybe the 49er was a bit much but in sub planing conditions waterline length is king.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote mpl720 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 05 at 10:11am

The easiest way to get a concept like this going - and its an excellent one - is to adapt what is already there as others suggest.  To my mind why not change the wing system on something like the Boss with a modest tramp across the back for the helm and run a single trapeze for the crew.  It's fast, easily handled, very light, carbon rig and a has a very powerful and (now) well developed sail plan.   They can also be purchased cheaply at the moment and that is what is needed to have any chance of real success.  This approach will never produce a 49er beater but that is not the prime objective surely - but it would be very far from being slow !.   This approach would be much more practical and much more affordable to get started - Yes you could use an 800 in single tramp mode but it would not carry the weight as well etc etc.  I remember when the Boss  came second to the 49er in the selection trials so its worth a second look - it might even find its niche yet on a revised basis with a second PN !

I'd guess that any combined crew weight below 155-160kg would struggle and the optimum weight would be something like 170-180+kg in single wire mode.  Anyway perhaps food for thought ? 

Cheers - Mike L.

    

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