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epicfail ![]() Groupie ![]() Joined: 01 Dec 19 Online Status: Offline Posts: 61 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 31 Aug 20 at 12:55pm |
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Another factor that didn't help was H is a boat I haven't encountered in this situation before; I'm always somewhat ahead. To be honest being in the same space as H was a bit annoying, that probably didn't help my frame of mind. Both races on Sunday were poor by my recent standards. Sailing can be so frustrating sometimes!
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Brass ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 24 Mar 08 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1151 |
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Maybe I should leave tactics to people who are good at it.
But I would say, you shouldn't tack to keep clear of a starboard tacker, reasons for tacking are: * to gain lee bow control, or * because you want to go to the left, or * possibly because starboard is determined to bounce you to the left and you have nowhere else to go. And for a starboard rounding mark, there's a lot to be said for coming in just below the starboard tack layline. Edited by Brass - 31 Aug 20 at 11:07am |
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JimC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6661 |
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Its a difficult situation. Going behind B and having to tack twice in the zone to reach the mark would be an even worse situation to be in. It would be rather easy to get shut out completely. In open water Brass is right, slowing/slipping behind and shooting round the mark is a good option, but light winds/disturbed air round an island/unpredictable shifts is a bit of a special case because its quite easy to get completely stuffed by shifts/weird eddies and that sort of thing.
I think tacking under B was possibly the least worst option. Where it went wrong, I suspect, was that because the other boat didn't tack when you expected it all got a bit rushed and impatience set in. |
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epicfail ![]() Groupie ![]() Joined: 01 Dec 19 Online Status: Offline Posts: 61 |
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Brass! Thank you, that is rather marvellous graphic and description of how the events unfolded. Clearly I made a poor decision not to either slow down or go behind B. After I tacked under and was the leeward boat I expected B to tack to port and go for the mark, as this didn't happen I was somewhat surprised. Interestingly I have the the event on camera, after the race B claimed I had "rammed" her which I politely disagreed with.
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Brass ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 24 Mar 08 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1151 |
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Your scenarios goes through quite a few stages where the rules may apply differently, so lets break them up, using a diagram Y, Yellow, You, B, Blue Him.
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@1 and @2 in the diagram.
Tactics comment: but that would have left you possibly able to shoot the mark, to leeward, inside, with all the rights in the world, or, if you had to tack, with starboard tack advantage on B. As it is, you have sailed yourself into a pin-out.
As JimC has described, up to here, Y is right of way boat, but B is entitled to mark-room, which, from 2 BL away from the mark is room to sail to the mark (Definitions: Mark-Room (a)). If you really are both past the layline (and are able to convince a protest committee of that), then B is sailing away from the mark, not sailing to the mark, not sailing within the mark-room to which she is entitled and therefore will not be exonerated under rule 21 if she fails to keep clear of Y. Y is exposed if she uses this aggressively: a protest committee might apply the last point of certainty, namely that B was NOT above the layline, and conclude that she was sailing to the mark, within her mark-room and entitled to exoneration. If Y luffs, bears away to avoid contact, and protests, this is a win/don't win protest for Y, so she can do that with safety, but if there is contact, it becomes a win/lose protest with Y at risk of penalty if she loses the protest. However, you go on to say that there were a few more things happening before contact occurred.
@3 and @4 in the diagram.
@5 in the diagram. Boats are in the zone, on same tack, B overlapped inside, rules 18.2(b) not applying so B is entitled to mark-room to sail to the mark, which she is doing (by changing course to do so), and B will be exonerated if she breaks a right of way rule, or rule 15 or 16 (rule 21).
If B had not yet reached her close hauled course when contact occurred, she was required to keep clear (rule 13), but is exonerated for that breach because she was sailing within the mark-room to which she was entitled. If B had reached her close hauled course when contact occurred, then she was leeward right of way boat, and it is Y, overlapped to windward, that has failed to keep clear and broken rule 11. There was contact. Even though there was no damage or injury and a boat may be exonerated under rule 14(b), we must consider rule 14. I think that Y could have avoided contact throughout: there was nothing (except a massive tactical disadvantage) to stop her from sailing higher and giving B a wider berth. Y did not avoid contact with B when it was reasonably possible to do so. Y broke rule 14. If the contact occurred before B reached her close hauled course (and was required to keep clear under rule 13), Y, the right of way boat shall be exonerated for breaking rule 14 (rule 14(b)). If contact occurred after B reached her close hauled course, then Y is neither the right of way boat nor entitled to room, and is thus not exonerated for breaking rule 14. I don't think B could have done anything to avoid contact once Y was coming down on her. B did not break rule 14. If this is wrong, and she could have avoided contact, she was a boat entitled to mark-room, and is exonerated for breaking rule 14 under rule 14(b). Edited by Brass - 31 Aug 20 at 1:29am |
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epicfail ![]() Groupie ![]() Joined: 01 Dec 19 Online Status: Offline Posts: 61 |
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Ok that makes sense. I'll aim to avoid putting myself in that situation again.
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JimC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6661 |
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> Can the ROW boat make no attempt?
Basically yes, there is no requirement to sail a proper course. It could be said that there's a general principle that a ROW boat can sail where she likes provided she doesn't make it impossible for the other boat to keep clear. An important concept to get across is the difference between right of way and an entitlement to room. See case 9 in the case book. (If you're not familiar with that its a download from the World sailing website. Its a list of examples of the rules in application). By the sound of things H delayed tacking until they were confident they could make the mark. You couldn't tack before then because of rule 13. Once both boats had tacked H had right of way *and* mark room. Where it would get sticky would be if H had not completed their tack and was not on a close hauled course. But on the whole I think you probably were right to take a penalty. |
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epicfail ![]() Groupie ![]() Joined: 01 Dec 19 Online Status: Offline Posts: 61 |
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I'm clearly no expert hence the question. But assuming I don't have right of way can the ROW boat make no attempt to round the mark in an efficient manner and as a result generally get in the way of my attempt to do so?
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If you are only two boat lengths from the mark isn’t H inside and therefore entitled to room regardless of being windward boat?
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epicfail ![]() Groupie ![]() Joined: 01 Dec 19 Online Status: Offline Posts: 61 |
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It was stb rounding.
After I tacked under and was leeward I did luff up hoping to make H tack. We were still about two lengths from the mark and I was sure we had gone beyond the layline. H didn't tack so I straightened up. After that it's a bit hard to describe accurately. We both ended up eventually tacking to port well after the time I considered sensible. H had trouble completing the tack for some reason (shifty wind near an island of trees) I'm now the windward boat happy to go for the mark only to find H inside me having a struggle to get through the tack. I put a hand out to keep the boats apart. All very slow motion.
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