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Olympic 'finals' proposal

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Stefan Lloyd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Olympic 'finals' proposal
    Posted: 11 Nov 05 at 7:40am
They are not short of cities queueing up to host the games, sailing included.
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Presuming Ed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Presuming Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 05 at 9:41am

But I'm sure that most bidding cities would be delighted if the Olympic consisted of nothing more than swimming, gymnastics and athletics - the big selling/ratings winning events, with a few more cheap sports for colour - not ones where you have to build specialised arena/venues.

Baseball/softball have been dropped for the London Olympics - and not been replaced with anything else.

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Cheeky View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Cheeky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 05 at 2:01pm
Originally posted by JimC

Originally posted by Stefan Lloyd

The question is, how would it look
if the IOC threw out a major sport just to get better TV coverage? A
hollow threat, I suspect.


They'd be throwing out an unpopular minority sport which would bring a
huge and totally disproportianate reduction in the costs of staging the
event. A big hit with just about everey city wishing to host the games I
should think.


Jim's right... sailing at the Olympics is...

A minority sport,.... in terms of viewer-ship. Expensive to organise,
expensive to televise e.t.c hence the recent proposals so the investment
gets a return!

Unfortunately sailing doesn't have any regular spectatorship. So a global
ordinance se has to be educated every 4 years.

Unfortunately we seem to be looking at this from inside the gold fish
bowl. Start thinking of the Olympics as a Advert for your sport and you'll
get a different perspective.

Yes, I'm not sure I'd like to see the format taken up by my clubs RO but I
am sure that this wouldn't happen, judging from the feelings on here
anyway.
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Stefan Lloyd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 05 at 3:09pm

Originally posted by Cheeky

Start thinking of the Olympics as a Advert for your sport and you'll get a different perspective.

But I don't. I think of it, as it has been up to now, as the pinnacle of my sport. The same thing we all do but taken to the Nth degree. I don't really care whether Joe Public wants to watch it on TV and I don't think these proposals would make much difference to that anyway. Joe Public will always prefer Beach Volleyball. 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Cheeky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 05 at 5:43pm
Beach volleyball!..... prefer it..... So do I.

Pinnacle of our sport? Now your just being silly. can't see the
Americas cup boys thinking that, and I don't see any Dev boats in the
Olympics. But you can build a new Hi Tech bike and whip the other track
cycling boys arses. What I'm saying is the modern Olympics is full of
hypocrisy and double standards. It is in fact a vast group of arbitrary
races. Over recent years it has become a highly political commercialised
event with its own odd competitive atmosphere. The values and images
you are justifiably trying to hold on to went out the window 40 years ago.
To the detriment of global sporting culture, but they have gone. And
unfortunately we need to stay with programme, and embrace it, in fact
utilise it to improve, expand and involve more people in our sport.
Changing a race format of a group of elite arbitrary sail boat racers for
the benefit of increased viewer excitement is a small price to pay for the
increased exposure and interest generated.
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Stefan Lloyd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 05 at 7:28am

I don't see the AC as the pinnacle of sailing, although it is the pinnacle of cheque-book sailing. The point about Olympic sailing is it is reasonably accessible to anyone with the talent; at least that is the case in the UK. You could not say that about the AC.

If the objective of Olympic sailing is to find the best sailors in the world, the new format seriously damages that. If the objective is to produce exciting TV, it is ridiculously unlikely to succeed without many other changes. The proposals are half-baked by either set of criteria.

 

 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Bumble Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 05 at 2:15pm

Dinghy sailing is a unique sport where the pinnacle cannot be reached by winning in 1 class, whatever the event is. To be considered a master you must be a multiple champ in many classes over many years.

All that happends with the Olympiic classes is that the olympics becomes the unofficial world champs. It strikes me the olympic selection is the kiss of death for any class in the UK...... why would anyone want to compete in a class where the only way to be the champ is to become a pro sailor and devote 5 years to a potentially fruitless campain.

Face it..... olympic sailing show cases nothing, is crap on TV and does nothing for grass roots sailing except present the sport as an elitist, expensive, boring white mans hobbie horse. None of which it is(or needs to be).

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Stefan Lloyd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 05 at 2:39pm

Originally posted by Bumble

It strikes me the olympic selection is the kiss of death for any class in the UK.

Lasers seem pretty unaffected as grassroots class - possibly a special case. Europes initially had an strong upsurge in interest, then fell away, at least in part for the reasons you suggest. Finns and Tornados survive as a grassroots classes here and there. In general though, I agree it's not obvious why a class would want Olympic selection. Selection followed by deselection is the nightmare scenario for a class. Without the Olympics, the Europe would probably still be going nicely as a niche lightweight/youth/women's class, as it was before selection. Having been selected then dropped, the outlook is bleak, since all the grassroots sailors have long gone.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Bumble Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 05 at 4:14pm

And thats just touching the recent classes. I can't think of 1 class whaich has fared well out of olympic selection and the FD tale will bring a tear to any sailors eyes.

I know this thread is now a pointless 900+ posts long but to just pick up on one of the older points made......... I love sailing and I love watching sport on TV - I have never ever seen any sailing on TV which was entertaining, and every Olympics I appologise to my none sailing friends and make excuses that sailing really is exciting.

To reitterate, sailing in the Olympics is crap and unsuitable, doing nothing for the sport and nothing for the good of the games.

If I had to propose a class/format change it would be to sail in 1 class only, open to both sexes, match or team racing......knock out ladder.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 05 at 7:50pm

Bumble may lack some historical perspective - the Firefly was an Olympic boat in 1948 and is still going strong. The Dragon of course is now more popular than when it was an Olympic boat - as is the Int 5.5m. The 12 sq m Sharpie still has active fleets in Norfolk and Holland

The FD worlds still get a fair few boats, as does the Tempest (the ultimate heavyweight trapeze class) and even the Soling. And I am convinced that the Star would continue if  they ever find an acceptable substitute.

Apart from the Laser and the 470, none of the present boats were ever intended to be popular mass appeal boats.

It was Bob Fisher who said recently that sailing should not be shown live. Edited highlights are a much better way of presenting the sport.

There are other sports in which nothing much happens for long periods... cycle road racing, cricket for instance. They only become interesting because there is so much to commentate on outside the central event, and because the production team make much use of analysis, infill material (history of the event, the fruit cake they had for tea..), action replay etc. Doesn't seem to work for sailing.

 

Gordon

 

 

 

 

 

 

Gordon
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