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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 4000 Facelift by Rooster
    Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 5:42pm
Mike

I think you are spot on with most of your comments. I'd only take issue with a couple of points. Firstly who told you a 200 was an easy starter boat Shocked, they are tippy little blighters. 

Oh and much that I wish Rooster well, still don't think a new 10-12k 4000 will cause a stampede ( or even a polite queue).

I actually think all clubs should limit allowable sailing craft to 1 x cat, 1x una rigged singlehander, 1 x skiff /kite singlehander, 1 x non hiking double hander and 1 x skiff double hander. We would all moan about not being able to sail what we wanted, but reality is 20 lasers, 20 visions and 10 800's on a Wednesday night would be much more of a laugh than 50 different boats and some weird handicap system. Some people I know even have different classes for different wind strengths .......... Angry

Because more people sailed the same boat getting crew would be made much easier as well.
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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 5:45pm
The club around here which seems to have a strong policy and the suitable bases covered is Shustoke SC- have a google to see what I mean...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 5:47pm
Originally posted by yellowwelly

The truth is that around here, even if I wanted to, most of the clubs I could join wouldn't accept the Laser 4000 due to PY boundaries preventing it.  Or there are other weird and wonderful safety rules- South Cerney for example has a 'no racks' policy (except for the Blaze which has dispensation I believe).  

West Oxford, Shustoke & Banbury SC are some which wouldn't let you sail one as it's too quick.

Barnt Green has a handicap fleet for asymmetrics - just as long as the PY is between 1057 and 1099!

I'm pretty sure these rules will have been around a while- they sound fairly antiquated by the nature of them.  Therefore boats like the 4000 and ISO were developed for larger locations- that market segment spoke back - boom and bust.  The 4000 has no real future- not as a new production boat anyway.  


I am not here to knock the smaller sailing waters, I know they provide another facet of our sport.
Put all that aside.
For sure there was a boom in the 90's.
How many new fast SMOD Asy classes?
Iso, RS400, Buzz, Boss, Spice, L4000, 29er, 59er, L5000, etc.
It was all very fashionable for a while, and a lot of people came in who were not ideally matched to these boats. All the builders were needing volume to keep prices down, so when some people left, the market collapsed.
But there remains a significant number of people who are right for these boats, so there probably is a market for a smaller number of classes, set up with supply chains geared to smaller annual sales.

It's like windsurfing, eveybody wanted one in 1985 or 1989, then it went out of fashion as the majority realised it wasn't really for them, now it has shrunk, but there are  still a significant core of people who've stuck with it,  and new people buying kit.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 6:01pm
There aren't that many people buy windsurfing kit- even NP have pulled out of any direct dealings with the UK market.... Give it 5 or so years and it will be a niche watersport serviced by artisan independent sail makers and board shapers.

The only saving chance windsurfing has is putting small rigs on sup boards... I don't hold out much hope for it to be honest. Not that I care really... Even as a modest intermediate I'm already experiencing the better build qualities of independent board shaper and my next sail is likely to be built at a small loft in Cornwall, not some sweat shop in the Far East for an (ironically named) 'big brand'.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Bootscooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 6:14pm
Originally posted by yellowwelly

   Either way MOST of th clubs within an hour of me wouldn't let anything much quicker than a 300 on them- even fireballs are deemed too fast!!!!


The flip side of this statement is that there are clubs in the area you mention that are suitable for all the fast boats you mention and would allow you in to race them.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 6:27pm
one, possibly two within an hour... the one I am currently a member of, see for yourself if there's anyone actually racing something even vaguely equitable- the results are on the site - despite being the only place within our region that could cater for this speed of boat... demand just isn't there.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 6:27pm
Originally posted by yellowwelly

There aren't that many people buy windsurfing kit- even NP have pulled out of any direct dealings with the UK market.... Give it 5 or so years and it will be a niche watersport serviced by artisan independent sail makers and board shapers.

The only saving chance windsurfing has is putting small rigs on sup boards... I don't hold out much hope for it to be honest. Not that I care really... Even as a modest intermediate I'm already experiencing the better build qualities of independent board shaper and my next sail is likely to be built at a small loft in Cornwall, not some sweat shop in the Far East for an (ironically named) 'big brand'.


I think windsurfing will still be there for me to watch when it's too windy, long after everyone has realised that paddling is mostly better done sitting down.
Somebody markets something, everyone has a go, either most people move on or a better version comes along. Half of those who stick who stick with it spend a fortune on arcane or bespoke parts.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Bootscooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 6:33pm
I'm only going on the way you mentioned West Oxford earlier, because if you're prepared to go there, but want to race an asymmetric, there's a whole fleet of them not 5 minutes away at Oxford (49er, RS800, RS700, Musto Skiff, RS400, Alto, L3K, L2K....).
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 7:33pm
funny you should mention that.... I'll be looking in OSC in a few weeks time.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pondlife1736 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jan 14 at 7:53pm
Originally posted by SimonW99



I actually think all clubs should limit allowable sailing craft to 1 x cat, 1x una rigged singlehander, 1 x skiff /kite singlehander, 1 x non hiking double hander and 1 x skiff double hander. We would all moan about not being able to sail what we wanted, but reality is 20 lasers, 20 visions and 10 800's on a Wednesday night would be much more of a laugh than 50 different boats and some weird handicap system. 

No no no - some of us like handicap racing, we want to sail the boat of our choice, and don't give a damn about series results or PY. To me, the only thing that matters is having a good race with whoever/whatever boat happens to be well matched to me on that particular day.
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