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The predictability of PYAG

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Rupert View Drop Down
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    Posted: 07 Mar 16 at 9:06pm
The Streaker's changes have been more recent than the Solo's, so it is possible that the system still has some catching up to do. A modern Streaker is worlds away from the old, heavy, soft wood boats that they used to be.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 16 at 9:26pm
Then so is a modern Solo
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 16 at 9:28pm
Originally posted by Rupert

The Streaker's changes have been more recent than the Solo's, so it is possible that the system still has some catching up to do. A modern Streaker is worlds away from the old, heavy, soft wood boats that they used to be.


Catching up to do?  I breifly had a rooster/beer epoxy streaker in 2009 or 2010ish (can't remember which year exactly) and since then the same beer epoxy streaker has had I think almost 30 points taken off.  It's a bit worrying if there's even more catching up to do. 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Late starter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 16 at 11:51pm
Originally posted by iGRF

Originally posted by Mark Jardine

GRFI've had enough of your PYAG group bashing. They are volunteers doing a job and the repetitiveness of your argument is mind-numbingly dull. Stop it. Now.Mark



Well until I see a list of who they are and their class affiliations, a complete transparency of their methodology and that they are routinely resigned/replaced to prevent corrupt activity then I'm not going to stop, here or on facebook. They are acting in my humble opinion contrary to the activity of most of us at grassroots level, I have yet to meet anyone who has a kind word to say about them, frankly if I were them rather than whining to you to get me to stop, they should resign.
What utter rubbish.  
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Post Options Post Options   Quote fab100 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 16 at 12:46am
Oh the grumph trolling. What a load of carp.

Has no one noticed it is called a 'yardstick' not a 'micrometer'? Surely the name is a clue?

Has no one noticed that, even in a strict one design, open meeting placings in consistent conditions across a day can be all over the place? I've never see a decent fleet with the same positions for each boat in every race. If it were like that we'd probably find something else to do. So how can anyone other than a demented troll argue that any handicapping system for a menagerie race, no matter it's basis, be accurate to 3.6 seconds in an hour, when class racing swings between 2 people, on the same day, in the same conditions can be easily 10 times that big?

So, I suggest corrected time results should  be unabbreviated to include something like "using an unavoidably imperfect averaging system based on voluntarily submitted race-time returns from inconsistent locations around the country for last year, without adjusting for sailor ability, race management team competence, prevailing conditions (whether venue or weather based), abilities of sailors nor condition of their equipment and applying that imperfect coefficient to today's race, the just-for-fun spuriously accurate results are..." 

And no grf, don't bother with a FTFY, no one will give a damn




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Post Options Post Options   Quote realnutter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 16 at 12:49am
Does the PY returns system include who's sailing each boat??  What happens when I change classes? Does my average result in my old class weight my performance in my new class? Does the fact that I was crap in a Laser, due to being too light, too old, and too unfit, but suddenly quite successful in a more fitting boat get tracked?

A decent yardstick system needs to look at  these things too..  
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 16 at 7:58am
Originally posted by realnutter

Does the PY returns system include who's sailing each boat??  What happens when I change classes? Does my average result in my old class weight my performance in my new class? Does the fact that I was crap in a Laser, due to being too light, too old, and too unfit, but suddenly quite successful in a more fitting boat get tracked?

A decent yardstick system needs to look at  these things too..  


Again, things like that are down to your club to work towards their own set of adjusted numbers.  Club specific numbers are also exactly what GRF needs to be looking at.  We can all solve our own problems or we can try to rely on others to do it for us then moan at them from a distance. 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon1277 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 16 at 8:32am
Hi Jim and Doug
Changing the subject, When the PY went from 3 figures to 4 why did they not just add a nought and adjust from there, I believe it was approx 9.
This is not knocking just interested in the history.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 16 at 8:40am
Originally posted by Doug.H


Originally posted by Rupert

The Streaker's changes have been more recent than the Solo's, so it is possible that the system still has some catching up to do. A modern Streaker is worlds away from the old, heavy, soft wood boats that they used to be.
Catching up to do?  I breifly had a rooster/beer epoxy streaker in 2009 or 2010ish (can't remember which year exactly) and since then the same beer epoxy streaker has had I think almost 30 points taken off.  It's a bit worrying if there's even more catching up to do. 


Yup, it has taken longer than that for the Solo's, but then there are more old, slow Solos out there. I'm surprised how the handicap has dropped, even so, but it really shows what a great design it is, developed nearly 20 years after the Solo, that with quite a small sail the hull can move that quick.

Holt was a clever man, and the class is attracting some top sailors. All the small singlehanders struggle to make themselves seen above the Solo/Laser brick wall, but the Streaker is managing it.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 16 at 8:52am
Originally posted by gordon1277

I believe it was approx 9.

9.41 IIRC. I have no idea why, I never heard. In those days they had a big thing about discouraging the use of out of date numbers, maybe it was something to do with that.
To my mind they should simply have doubled the numbers. The worst part of the 4 digit numbers is people make such a huge fuss over a 10 point change but wouldn't over a 1 point one.
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