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Nationals attendance.
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Er-Indoors View Drop Down
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Posts: 146 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Er-Indoors Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Nationals attendance.
    Posted: 21 Nov 13 at 3:17pm
I am trained in swordcraft and toxophily, I have the tools to cope ;-)
Hmm swinging from rigging bandishing a sabre.......
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Nipper View Drop Down
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Posts: 40 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Nipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 13 at 11:43am
Coming back to the original thread, here's my 10p's worth.
 
The Lightning class should be chuffed to bits that they get 25 boats for a Nationals, and that if they hadn't of put the effort in, they would probably getting 10 boats.
 
Looking at the class website, 350 Lightnings have been built since 1978, and only 30 since 2000, so getting 25 at a Nationals represents 14% of their boats.
 
Without doing the research and maths, I bet the Solo and Streaker come nowhere close to that ratio (on boats built since 1978)
 
However for the Lightnings to increase their Nationals attendance looks a tall order. 
 
1) The boats are mainly sailed at small inland clubs, because they are probably best suited to small inland waters. They never have been a class sailed in any number on the coasts that I can remember. Therefore to have a Nationals at a coastal club with the potential for wind and waves will either a) put them off from going at all, or b) if they do go, and the wind an waves get up, then they will get tired and frightened, the boats will break,  and they will not want to go ever again.
Similarly, a long weekend in the summer at Grafham/Draycote/Rutland is also probably not massively attractive either.
 
2) The boat with its restrictive rig is not attctive to the boatbuilders/spar maker/sailmakers, so they will stick to the less restrictive Solo's and Streakers, and the keen/wannabee lightweight/juniors will stick to the Laser Radial.
 
 
Ligthning's have their niche, If they have not attracted a large audiance in 35 years, they are unlikely to do so now, so the class should concentrate on what they are doing well now, not look enviously at other classes.
39 years of dinghy racing and still waiting to peak.
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iGRF View Drop Down
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Posts: 6499 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 13 at 12:15pm
We have a lightning racing at Hythe, he was out in it on Sunday, I'd considered trying to blag it off him for the winter down the lake, one of our high flyers (literally, a Helicopter flying executive0 brought it down, he's a handy helm I think he was some sort of youth squad champion in it, did they use them for that years ago or have I got the wrong end of the stick, he's a good sailor anyway, bought my chums old Phantom and beats him in his new one in it as is pretty standard for us windsurfers when we sell our boats to sailors who can do it properly.
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Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 13 at 12:20pm
You know, Nipper, I think you are probably right. I was attracted to the class because of the small size - it is more fun, as far as I'm concerned.
In fact, at West Oxford a couple of weekends ago we got 29 boats out (with one broken down on the motorway). I think you are right that without the fun factor and self promotion we would be getting half that.

The Solution looks like a lovely boat, but only got 5 to their Inlands recently. Is the difference that the Lightning has a supply of older boats for people to get started in the class, but the Solution never got the chance to build a fleet in the shrinking market?
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Posts: 392 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iitick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 13 at 12:23pm
You are wrong on that. You should try it (Lightning). My preferred class at my weight would of course be the wonderful Byte C2 but Lightnings are much more stable and predictable and so I sail a Lightning. Lightning also have a sea championship in addition to the Nationals and Inlands for those who wish to try waves.

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Posts: 40 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Nipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 13 at 1:09pm
Originally posted by iitick

You are wrong on that. You should try it (Lightning). My preferred class at my weight would of course be the wonderful Byte C2 but Lightnings are much more stable and predictable and so I sail a Lightning. Lightning also have a sea championship in addition to the Nationals and Inlands for those who wish to try waves.

I trial sailed a Lightning on the Solent back in the very early 80's when Phil Chester was involved with them. the only things that made an impact on me was that it was 2 tone brown, the mast was very close to the bow, and in a Solent chop, going to windward the bow dug in and waves came over the front and the cockpit filled up. I have never sailed a Byte so cannot compare, but in 1980 I had sailed a Laser, and the Lightning felt of similar stability. 
 
I know that Lightnings do have a sea championship, but Weston is not a real sea club compared to Plymouth/Paignton/Mounts Bay/Hayling etc where other classes hold their Nationals.
 
39 years of dinghy racing and still waiting to peak.
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Posts: 40 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Nipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 13 at 1:59pm
Originally posted by Rupert

You know, Nipper, I think you are probably right. I was attracted to the class because of the small size - it is more fun, as far as I'm concerned.
In fact, at West Oxford a couple of weekends ago we got 29 boats out (with one broken down on the motorway). I think you are right that without the fun factor and self promotion we would be getting half that.

The Solution looks like a lovely boat, but only got 5 to their Inlands recently. Is the difference that the Lightning has a supply of older boats for people to get started in the class, but the Solution never got the chance to build a fleet in the shrinking market?
Rupert like you, I think the Solution looks a nice boat, but from its birth I could never see the market for it.
 
It was basically designed as a Phantom for small people, (Kevin Clarke the Solution's designer, built and sailed a Phantom but he was too small for it).
 
But the Phantom was originally designed as a Solo for large people.
 
So the Solution is basically aimed at the same size people as the Solo, costs about the same as a Solo, but goes a bit faster.
 
It might have had a chance against then against the Solo, but the Solo class has upped its game in recent years and  Winder, Boon, Speed  etc produce high quality good looking foam epoxy boats, with excellent fit out so that the new Solos look as upto date as the Solution.
The Solution may well be a better sailing experience than the Solo (I haven't sailed one), but I cannot see it has enough differentiating factors to make a large number of people choose it over the Solo or Laser  Radial.
Yet another UK niche class.
 
PS - Congratulations on 29 boats at West Oxford, looks like the assocaition is giving the class what it wants. 
 
 
39 years of dinghy racing and still waiting to peak.
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Posts: 116 		Post Options Post Options   Quote robin34024 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 13 at 5:44pm
''I know that Lightnings do have a sea championship, but Weston is not a real sea club compared to Plymouth/Paignton/Mounts Bay/Hayling etc where other classes hold their Nationals.''

At least the lightnings had some kind of sea championships. The streakers had a nationals at Northampton and an inlands at Bassenthwaite!
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Posts: 3958 		Post Options Post Options   Quote winging it Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 13 at 6:06pm
Didn't the streakers have a nationals at Lancing not that long ago?   
the same, but different...

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rogerd View Drop Down
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Posts: 1076 		Post Options Post Options   Quote rogerd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 13 at 6:18pm
I detect a certain amount of sea snobbery coming in here.
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