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K1 - Whats the point?

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Norbert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Norbert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: K1 - Whats the point?
    Posted: 21 Jan 10 at 1:19pm
Originally posted by turnturtle

Originally posted by Jack Sparrow


i think I'd be more interested in something like this...
linkhttp://www.scandinaviancruisers.com/our_yachts.com/groups/sc20/">picture link http://www.flickr.com/groups/sc20/21_115308_4173951250_f12c4 5189d.jpg">edit: link to v=8xysIrz1vTQ&feature=related">video


what a beautiful looking boat- now that's got to be up there on desirability, if practicality isn't an issue?


James, were you using Google Chrome when you did your reply? If so that is exactly the problem i was having regarding images and stuff that Mark wanted details of.


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G.R.F. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote G.R.F. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jan 10 at 2:42pm
They corrected that line break in the link issue in the Boards version of the
forum.

I forget how long ago I pointed the problem out.

It's the same with Firefox.

Basically any link text or image if permitted to line break within the dialogue
box will fail.
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Jack Sparrow View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Jack Sparrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jan 10 at 7:28pm
Originally posted by Norbert

Expensive (very) from $25000,
[/QUOTE]

It's £15,500 GBP. I think that is good value for a boat like this. You can pay more for a Merlin, i14... etc whats a FF these days?
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jan 10 at 6:23pm

With this thread and the dinghy trials thread running, I posted on the cvrda site about the interest being shown in oild boats here. David Henshall, mr Bearface media, works for a rival publication so doesn't tend to post here, but I have cut and pasted his info on the discussions below.

"Regarding Peter Milne, the Typhoon, Wildfire and other developments, there appears to have been a little bit of confusion which I hope this short overview can clear up.

Ian Proctor designed the Typhoon as an advanced 2 person performance boat, with the idea that the hull would be a strict one design, built by a licenced builder in GRP, whilst the rig was open allowing restricted development. Bear in mind the situation at the time - the Fireball and 470 were still establishing their position, the only other boat at the time in competition with the Typhoon was the Hornet. Sadly, despite a number of novel ideas, the Typhoon bombed, with one famous helm who sailed it for one of the magazines describing it as a 'horrid boat to sail' ( a shame as it was a very attractive boat out on the water and gave helm and crew an exciting ride).

Ian Proctor also designed a mini Keelboat which as you've already seen is the Wldfire.

Peter Milne on the other hand designed a very similar boat which was called the Vulcan. All the usual Peter Milne sweetness in boat handling terms but like the Wildfire, the Vulcan too ended up on the list of Lost Classes. The Vulcan and Wildfire have their place in history though, as in a way they are the great grandparents of the sportboats revolution that is so market grabbing today.

And yes, Peter did do a mini FD, the Javelin, a class that has an albeit small niche but otherwise is still with us today. Like so many Milne boats, the Javelin was a joy to sail, all the more so in breeze when the long, easily driven hull really came into it's own.

To those worried about the proliferation of classes, they only have to look at the fate of the Typhoon, Wildfire and Vulcan to see that the dinghy sailing scene is remarkably resilient at ensuring that good boats succeed and the lesser offerings disappear into obscurity (which is why it is so hard to find details on these boats). Of course there is a danger that if someone comes along with an excellent boat, be it one person keelboat or two person high performance skiff, that the exsisting classes may have to make room for it. Best advice, based on how dinghy development has panned out so far, is to wait for that to happen, then see how the current boats measure up against the newcomer"

David Henshall
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jan 10 at 6:29pm

And this is the Vulcan

Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Post Options Post Options   Quote NickA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jan 10 at 8:54pm
Vandercraft say they've sold plenty of K1s already (more than 10 anyway), even without the marketing muscle of RS or the-company-formerly-known-as-performance-sailcraft.

So evidently it is for something that people want.  Mostly gentleman sailors "of a certain age" apparently.  Some of whom are going to be a little suprised by it's speed and the initial tippiness before the keel kicks in.

Personally I'd rather retire to a K-1 than a soslow.  But only at a club with a nice smooth gentle slipway! .... and did anyone else think the rig looked a bit flimsy?
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scowsailor View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote scowsailor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jan 10 at 9:51pm
The concept of a ballasted dinghy is an interesting one.
Will it be the best of both world's or worst of both?
Some say the SB3 is best of both worlds and the K6 the
worst of both world's. Who knows?

I had been interested in the concept for years and had
wondered why none were available on the market, perhaps
proving the idea did not work. However, when the Laser
Stratos Keel came out some years ago, I thought of it as
a small sports boat, rather than the family friendly safe
dinghy that it is marketed as. I bought one.

My son and I had some great blasting down the Solent in
force 5 westerlies. Superb long planes down to Newtown,
then easy beats back. The 100kg bulb doing most of the
work on the way back.

If we made an error, caught the tiller extension or
something, she would heel so far and then steady, giving
enough time to recover.

She was hard work in the shallow waters of Keyhaven where
I sail though. The rudder would keep knocking up and
control would be lost. My Wayfarer in the same situation
was fine.

Anyway - I prefer to sail singlehanded so sold her and
really hoped a singlehanded version would come along.

And her she is. Would I buy one? For sailing from
Keyhaven - no. Shallow shingle beach would be a real
problem to return to and get away from.

Perhaps from Lymington, using the LTSC pontoons? Launch
and paddle across to pontoon, sort boat, cast off not too
bad.

Returning - with no crew, cope with pontoon without
damaging new boat in all sorts of winds - and pull up the
steep ramp at Lymington on my own? 125kg, plus trolley,
plus gear? No way on your own. 90kg is probably the max I
think.

Lovely boat though, just needs two shore crew to look
after me!

Brian



Edited by scowsailor
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Stefan Lloyd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 10 at 8:15am
Originally posted by scowsailor

The concept of a ballasted dinghy is an interesting one.
Will it be the best of both world's or worst of both?
Some say the SB3 is best of both worlds and the K6 the
worst of both world's.


I'd be curious to know who says that. I've sailed both and considered buying both. They are completely different kinds of boat.

The SB3 is a sportsboat, not a ballasted dinghy. It weighs 635kg which means you can't launch and retrieve it without a crane or car. It's required to carry an outboard or equivalent weight. There is no way to operate it like you operate a dinghy. A large proportion of UK SB3s are operated for convenience out of dry-sailing boatyards, with the operating budget than implies i.e. an order of magnitude more than a dinghy club membership.

K6 is a ballasted dinghy. It weighs less than half what an SB3 weighs. It doesn't carry an outboard. Given a low-angled concrete ramp and sheltered launching location, it is possible to operate it like a dinghy.

I'd also say the K6 is a far better designed and constructed boat than the SB3. However there are incumbent "ballasted dinghy" classes out there such as the FF and the K6 never found much of a niche, whereas the SB3 found the market space of a 20 foot sportsboat unoccupied in GBR and IRL. The SB3 has found it much harder to make headway against the Viper in the USA, which is both to some extent an incumbent class and arguably a better boat.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote koechli Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 10 at 4:55pm
I sail a 20ft ballasted dinghy in Switzerland (or is it a sportsboat ? ). It's a Dutch boat called Sailhorse and I love it (even if I am probably the only one who sails that kind of boat here). However mine is just 4 years younger than I am and is starting to require lots of loving care (just like me).
I like to sail alone, with a friend or with my wife and  2 children.
I found the K6 to be my dream boat (200kg lighter that the Sailhorse) but I don't have the budget to buy one. I considered buying an RS Vision but I don't like the idea of capsizing.
I was looking for a single-handed keelboat (because I have trouble sailing the Sailhorse alone when there is wind) and I found the 2.4mR but It looks like a kayak with sails.
I think that the K1 has a market with people like me who sail on a restricted budget and don't like to capsize (and are fed up with painting/repairing their old 5th hand boat). My major problem is that I probably won't be able to take the whole family on the K1. Does anyone know how many people are allowed on the K1 ?
I am also curious to know how quick it is compared to a Laser standard for example...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Slippery Jim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 10 at 5:17pm
Hi and welcome to the forum koechli!
On which lake of CH do you sail?
Pass the skiff, man!
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