Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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List classes of boat for sale |
Youth classes |
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Jon Emmett ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 15 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 988 |
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For the Radial I think being under 70Kgs is definitely a good thing. The last two World Championships sailed in moderate breeze were won by Men under 70Kgs. As far as the change from Europe to Radial, the Radial is a more physical boat (as it has a less responsive rig) so a lot of the girls have hit the gym, gaining strength (and weight),,, Just out of interest the Radial has much less sail area than the Europe.
Edited by Jon Emmett |
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les5269 ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Oct 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1530 |
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So theorectically it shouldn't make any difference if they are slightly out of the optimum weight range?
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49er 531 & 5000 5025 and a mirror(now gone to mirror heaven)!
Grafham water Sailing Club The greatest inland sailing in the country |
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Hey Guys! just whilst we're in this weight range convo Doug |
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Bumble ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Nov 05 Location: Taiwan Online Status: Offline Posts: 302 |
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Not true..... its a huge factor, just different hulls have different characteristics under loading.
The finn is naturally tolerant of a wide range of weights due to high dispacement and a hull shape which, under loading, increases imersion without proportionally increasing waterline beam. Some 5+kilos is very little for this class, and even less for Mr Emmett who feels its quite reasonable to train hopeful female Olympians with protein and weights to gain at least twice that.
Weight (so long as not excessive) slowing you down in the light stuff, especially 'minimal' winds, is a myth. The sole indicator for over 100years of a boats light wind speed potential is the waterline length/sail area ratio...... the sail/weight (so called Bruce number) has no relevance till strong motion is given. For every kilo added in righting moment more force on the sail can be balanced up to a threshold, when it tails off ... in the case of some dinghies very sharply - this threshold gives us the optimum weight for a given hull and in most cases has nothing to do with sail area. The myth that more weight in a dinghy can enable you to carry more sailarea in more wind exists because thats how it feels when you are over powered but, the reality with most planninghulls is, the threshold weight is very close to the lower limit needed to stop it tipping over. Edited by Bumble |
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les5269 ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Oct 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1530 |
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Quite agree Bumble I sailed 5ks and in the light stuff we could whip the likes of 49ers and 800s,most of the time beating them on the water!(we weighed about 160kgs and the boat 180kgs slightly more than the average 49er!)
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49er 531 & 5000 5025 and a mirror(now gone to mirror heaven)!
Grafham water Sailing Club The greatest inland sailing in the country |
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Jon Emmett ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 15 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 988 |
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I do not know any of the girls who have put on more than a kilo or two! (I am sure I would have noticed if any had gained over 10 Kilos!!!) and yes I feel it is quite reasonable for the radial girls to go to the gym, this is a natural part of training for all sports!
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Also in jons defence, i dont think its a case of being reasonable for ppl to train using protein suppliments. The ones reccomended by the rya were considered and tested in the highest respect before being given the go ahead for anyones use. And it is the sailors choice, they are not force fed anything. |
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Stefan Lloyd ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 03 Aug 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1599 |
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I'd also assume you can tune mast stiffness and sail shape to match weight. The Europe women certainly did so, while in the Radial they obviously cannot. |
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Jon Emmett ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 15 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 988 |
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Even though the Europe could tune their rig the girls tended to favour the rig of the people who were performing well and thus ended up matching their weight... So the spread of weights remained small (comparable to the Laser!)
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Bumble ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Nov 05 Location: Taiwan Online Status: Offline Posts: 302 |
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Indeed, and it naturally follows that a class of hull with a broader competitive weight tolerance would have more rigs to suit (change gear) a broader range of sailors. One with a tighter weight range would obviously better optimise around one. Im not so sure about the Europe but I thought, correct me if Im wrong.......... in the old days of aluminium masts, the cross sectional dimensions were fixed, and stiffness was given by how much aluminium went into the section, so a given flexibilty fore and aft had to be balanced by a similar lateral flexing. You choose the lateral flex for your weight and there should be a mast to fit. Then as C/fibre developed (and the Europe class, if nothing else has given us all plenty of development) manufacturers found that lateral stiffness could be delivered without compromising its longitudinal ability to flex, i.e. bend and depower. The weight of the helm could then be balanced on the sail, by means of fullness, height of fullness and leech tension. Changing a sail being more cost effective than a mast, the masts have become more uniform. Im sure Jons reason is true also, and this, as well as the above has been mirrored in many other classes. Take the OK...... hull has a high tolerance of 12-15 stone, rigs in aluminium used to be classed into 3 groups, red/green/blue (I think?). Now the've taken Carbonfibre on its just one with a variety of sails. The finns the same, covered by 2 rigs over a massive weight range.. The Europe with a 20kilo range is by comparison quite small. |
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