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Another club closure

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JimC View Drop Down
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    Posted: 25 May 22 at 10:46am
Originally posted by Mozzy

Has a club that offered class racing ever closed?

I doubt it, because I cannot imagine a club refusing to introduce handicap races if numbers in class starts became unsustainable.
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Sussex Lad View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sussex Lad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 22 at 11:04am
Originally posted by eric_c

Whole mix of issues there.
Forums are last century. This is a dinghy racing forum. People who enjoy a bimble on the water will likely be elsewhere, like our sailing club's facebook page.
I don't know how many clubs enjoy a good stream of RYA 1&2 adult new members. It's not something that has been big in any of my clubs in the last 30 years.
Lots of people try a few sports and drift out of them after a few years. In sailing it's rarely too late for them to return. Quite a few yacht owners I know are people who didn't really take to dinghy racing. As are one or two kitesurfers. Some of them may return with kids in toppers.


Forums are so last century? Some are but not all.

This is a racing forums?  10 years ago or more it wasn't exclusively a racing forum. Just as most clubs aren't exclusively about racing. Clubs are about many things: something to do, power boating (Ribs), socialising, course laying, boat bimbling, casual racing.........Granted, it has now become a monohull, elitist dinghy  racing forum. It has become exclusive rather than inclusive.

Quite a few clubs (judging by posts on here) enjoy a good throughput of 1&2 adults.  If a club can teach a hundred adults over a ten year period, not unreasonable, then potentially thats those folk plus kids, friends and spouses as members.....in reality it doesn't happen why? How many stay beyond 3 or 4 years? some do but not many.

How about we paint the walls a different shade of magnolia? No? ah well the status quo will do.

I think the Commercial clubs will win eventually it just a question of how long......shame shame shame
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sargesail Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 22 at 11:59am
Originally posted by Mozzy


Originally posted by Grumpycat




Think you have this the wrong way round. As most sailors are py racing .
You have to convince the majority of sailors that class racing is best and the future of sailing .  LOL
And it takes it back to my point ,if you sail py pursuits everyone knows who is winning.  Smile




PY racing seems a nice fit for those who have reached a comfortable level and would rather sail a boat they prefer, or keep interest by switching boats.
Is it good way to sustain the clubs though? Would new sailors prefer class racing? Would youth / young adults favour class racing? Has a club that offered class racing ever closed?Obviously I do handicap racing, and for me it's better than not racing, although not always better than just sailing. There is certainly a place for it at most clubs, but perhaps it shouldn't come at the cost of class racing which may be better suited to people who are otherwise voting with their feet? 



So I think comfortable level is key to this….

Over the years I have internally reinforced the received wisdom bias that class racing (actually coach supported race training in boats of one class is best) that class racing is the best way to learn from strategy, through tactics to manoeuvres and sail trim.

PY racing is one way not to be confronted with the reality of performance and what is required to improve (see various posts about lack of appetite for (supported) Learning.

For many it therefore hits a sweet spot of activity which doesn’t challenge self-image.

On the other hand I personally enjoy PY because the focus can absolutely be on boat speed and pure, rather than boat on boat tactics. It has its place in self-improvement. But in that I am preparing for what I really crave: the pressure of class racing.

Edited by sargesail - 25 May 22 at 11:59am
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eric_c View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote eric_c Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 22 at 12:04pm
This is the 'developement' forum hosted by what used to be a UK dead-tree magazine with a readership of  UK dinghy racers and yacht racers.
   There are other forums born out of other magazines, with different readerships. There may even still be an RYA forum. The YBW forum used to be quite lively, and about 95% non-racing, although biased towards yachts rather than dinghies. That isn't what it was 15 years ago either.The motorcycle world equally seems to have mostly moved away from forums towards specialist groups on Facebook. There are a few exceptions, the PistonHeads forum can offer some lively and diverse discussion on boating matters. This place is not representative of UK dinghy sailing as a whole. Was it ever intended to be?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sussex Lad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 22 at 12:58pm
We could bat this one backwards and forwards ad nauseum Eric. I know what used to get discussed on here and by whom, it was more diverse in those two respects by a country mile and if you were here you know it.


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Post Options Post Options   Quote DiscoBall Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 22 at 1:05pm
Clubs, classes and Internet forums are probably birds of a feather. They all act as engines for group polarisation, often leading activity/discussion in ever more specialised directions.

All activities (especially complex equipment based sports) probably have a finite life cycle - the keenest people end up running things and can't conceive that other people aren't as obsessed or struggle to catch up to the present state of the art. Easier to damn outsiders as lazy than consider trying to limit development or backtrack.

So either the sport disappears or some disruptive development moves things back to the centre ground. Of course anything that democratise and popularise a sport will be sniffed at by many who are at the elite end... I wonder if many clinker boat owners of the 1950-60s were disparaging about the boxy plywood boats of the dinghy boom?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote eric_c Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 22 at 2:00pm
Originally posted by Sussex Lad

We could bat this one backwards and forwards ad nauseum Eric. I know what used to get discussed on here and by whom, it was more diverse in those two respects by a country mile and if you were here you know it.




For sure ages ago there used to be enough people on here you could get some conversation on a wider range of topics, including actual development of boats. But as far as  I recall, it's always had a bit of negativity towards Squad sailors, Lasers, and maybe a few other classes. But Laser and 'development' are polar opposites....
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Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 22 at 2:02pm
There were a lot more women and young people at the start, they probably weren't driven away, they have probably migrated to social media.
I know a few people who just read this forum and the news section, just because there is only about fifty regular posters doesn't make it irrelevant, people are influenced, look at the skill set we have.
Robert
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 22 at 2:11pm
I'm not sure how to address this... I'm interested in dinghy racing not cruising/pottering (well a bit but what is there to discuss about blasting up and down?). I suspect cruisers and potterers are not joiners in the main, they don't need a club to support their activity so many don't join one. Same with the forums, if just going and sailing around the local beach or coastline is your thing what might you need to discuss on a forum like this?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sussex Lad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 22 at 2:25pm
Originally posted by 423zero

There were a lot more women and young people at the start, they probably weren't driven away, they have probably migrated to social media.
 


A bit of both I reckon. I can certainly remember some "banter" that proved to be the final straw for some. 
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