Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
![]() |
Laser 161752 Tynemouth |
![]() |
Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
![]() |
List classes of boat for sale |
Composite laser mast released |
Post Reply ![]() |
Page <12345 6> |
Author | |
Rupert ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 07 Dec 16 at 8:01pm |
Will the Laser be the only boat where insurance premiums go down with a carbon mast?
|
|
Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
|
|
![]() |
|
RS400atC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 04 Dec 08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3011 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Carbon masts can be repaired Metal ones are scrapped. Personally I've not found ali masts to be the key to cheap premiums. Alloy top section is not far above my excess. Yer actual bare tube, anodised any colour you like, is cheaper than a rake of ales and a good curry. |
|
![]() |
|
piglet ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 04 Jan 07 Online Status: Offline Posts: 514 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
What will Laser class rules have to say about composite mast repairs?
|
|
![]() |
|
Sam.Spoons ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3401 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Probably that you can have them repaired by an approved repairer who pays a commission to Laser for every repair ;)
|
|
![]() |
|
laser193713 ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 13 May 09 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 889 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Laser have mostly got it right, apart from a few times when it's gone pear shaped but mostly not down to the Laser 1.
I happen to know that because of the huge volumes of parts they are buying they get them very cheap. The example I was given was a toe strap, they were paying pennies for them, literally pennies. I can't remember the exact figure but it was something like 64p a unit. They retail for something in the region of £50, without looking. Some people look at that and say "how dare they!?" but most see the complete boat price and think "seems reasonable" and pay out. It's all very good poking fun at it but in reality you can't buy it cheaper, so in most cases you're better off just sucking it up and buying it. Most of us are sitting here moaning about stuff like this but working for companies that do at least try and make a profit. That's all they are doing is making a business work and if that means selling a mast for more than we might like to pay for it then good for them, so long as it isn't so expensive that people refuse to. The right price for any given part or boat is as much as you can possibly get away with, from a business point of view. If that means you don't make a profit then it's probably that its a bad product or your sales team need a good kicking, if it makes huge profits then who are we to complain, we bought it!
|
|
![]() |
|
Chris 249 ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 10 May 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2041 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
The whole sport should be looking over its shoulder, because if one of the most important classes in the world is damaged by those who carp about it then the whole sport will be seriously harmed. The Laser has GAINED market share compared to most of the classes that were around when it was at its peak. The Laser is not the problem with dinghy sailing - it's the other classes that have suffered the big drop in numbers. Why attack one of the few long term success stories? Edited by Chris 249 - 07 Dec 16 at 11:42pm |
|
sailcraftblog.wordpress.com
The history and design of the racing dinghy. |
|
![]() |
|
Chris 249 ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 10 May 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2041 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
There are also a lot of fables about Laser kit. My brother was top 25 in the open standard worlds, for example, and he had one old borrowed sail and one new sail in his entire Laser career. We've had people say that Tom Slingsby, for example, would go into the factory and weigh dozens of masts before selecting them. Tom (who I knew as a sub-junior) has told me to my face that's not true, and that he is not allowed in the factory. My former PhD supervisor was the chief scientist at the Australian Institute of Sport and in charge of the study of the bend characteristics of Laser masts, and he says that the study revealed no surprise at all. Stiffness is proportional to spar weight and the differences (in our sticks, anyway) is negligible. Krystal Weir, former world champ and another of our Olympic Laser reps, didn't have that many sails and like Tom or Michael Blackburn (world standard and Radial champ and Olympic medallist), she was not very gear conscious. Both Tom and Krystal have the attitude that it's silly to need special gear when you have to use supplied kit for the major regatta. Learning to adapt to the minor gear differences you may meet is a skill that is needed for success. The Laser as launched was developed quite a long way from the initial beach boat concept, by the way. At the time there were several vast multi-national conglomerates operating in the beach boat market in the USA, including some of the world's biggest companies. The Laser was developed into a serious but simple racing boat before the product was launched, because the backers did not have the cash to take on car and missile manufacturers in the beachboat market.
Edited by Chris 249 - 07 Dec 16 at 11:53pm |
|
sailcraftblog.wordpress.com
The history and design of the racing dinghy. |
|
![]() |
|
Rupert ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Chris, while you are correct that many of the top sailors won't be selecting gear, there are also documented examples of those who will measure mast rake, weigh topmasts, etc. But the vast majority of Laser sailors aren't in either camp, or even doing local open meetings. They are sailing in their club handicap fleet on a Sunday and on a Wednesday night. Some won't even be aware that the Laser is an Olympic class, let alone that a plastic topmast is now allowed. Be interesting to see the reaction at clubs when the first ones filter down to our level.
|
|
Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
|
|
![]() |
|
Sam.Spoons ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3401 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Paul Elvstrom was renowned for the hull finish on his own boats, it was usually terrible! He reckoned that a couple of days polishing the bottom was equivalent to one missed wind shift so went sailing instead.
The top laser guys don't need to buys new sail every year 'cos, as Chris points out, they get one supplied at every regatta ![]() I don't think the Laser is a bad boat, but neither is it a great boat. It has a number of shortcomings that make it quite unpleasant for me to sail (I have owned one and sailed several over the years) so I bought something else. It has been demonstrated that when a true one design allows improvements to hull construction and layout (Enterprise and Blaze are the two I have a particular interest in) without reducing weight or changing the hull shape, the new hulls, which may be nicer to sail, are not faster than a well maintained older boat. Laser could make the hulls more durable and introduce a deck layout that was 'shortaRSe friendly (something like a bigger Byte maybe) without making those boats faster than a Standard. They could also introduce a new rig (which probably would make the boat faster but would be a different class in the way that Radial is) which might rejuvenate the boats appeal to younger sailors as well as making it pleasanter to sail. I can't see how that would be bad for the class or the manufacturer, or the sailing public....... Edited by Sam.Spoons - 08 Dec 16 at 9:07am |
|
![]() |
|
Guests ![]() Guest Group ![]() |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
I have no problem with Laser (or any other class) updating periodically. Lasers issue seems to be the slightly haphazard manner in which it happens. the composite mast has been in the pipeline for years and years, but then gets introduced with just a few months notice. Meanwhile, in the US, you can't eve get a new sail.
If the ILCA, rights owners and builders published a 10-15 year plan it would provide some assurance and certainty as to the future of the class. Who would buy a new Laser today not knowing what the future holds? Edited by A2Z - 08 Dec 16 at 8:52am |
|
![]() |
Post Reply ![]() |
Page <12345 6> |
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions ![]() You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |