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    Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 3:24pm
Opens will be purely in class. That said you can look at the weather in advance and choose which class you want to enter! But thats no different to anything else.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 3:36pm
Originally posted by Rupert

So, when the Aeros all race together, non handicap, will there be some opens done like the 18 footers where it is all one class and choose your rig, just to make a change?

I don't see why not. The Laser class does this and you often see prize for first Radial and first 4.7.
Paul
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 3:43pm
I was more thinking that you could swap rigs for the weather, even 1/2 way through. I guess the trouble is that unlike 3 guys on a skiff, the weight differences in an Aero are too big compared to the boat for it not to dominate who does well.Not for normal opens, just for sh*t and giggles and a bottle of something.


Edited by Rupert - 06 Mar 15 at 3:45pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote blaze720 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 3:45pm

The Blaze family has three sails of different sizes that can ALL be used on the same set of standard spars.  Fire (8.8m), Blaze (10.4m) and Halo (11.5m) are however raced as totally different classes even when they share meetings.  If you wish to 'mix' your use of them then you are racing in a different class and all that goes with that - easy to understand and clear.

The sails have the NAME on them boldly displayed so it is very obvious and we and the CA have been very clear on this issue since day 1 as well.     

The ‘alternatives’, 'Fire' and 'Halo' are selling well and this year the major Blaze opens will have a separate start for them.  Note the separate bit.

The Blaze Nationals at Hayling Island in early July will not be the Nationals for either of these sister classes ....

Apart from all that the CA is pretty relaxed about expanding the Blaze family.  Like many classes we have growing groups of both 'senior' and 'junior' helms and of course 'larger' helms.  Pleasingly 'Fire' is not only appealing to the light(er), young(er) and old(er) - its also beginning to attract and keep more female helms.

Another plus is that in the age of web forecasts that some argue is reducing those prepared to travel to events owners can easily bring along 2 sails now.   If you are light and it is blowing the proverbial dogs off chains on arrival you can drop a sail size and still enjoy a decent meeting.  Conversely if you are on the large size and it is disappointingly light you can switch from Blaze to Halo etc.  A lot of the time of course the forecast will be wrong anyway ...but you will be there and can make a decision on the spot.   This is not even diluting Blaze numbers however as more people are pitching up at meetings as a result anyway - and when we crunch the numbers later in the season it is looking likely to be more positive all round.

The alternatives ?  Own multiple classes or just stay at home, or sit on the shore  .... not as attractive surely to owners or to any inclusive leaning class.  We want more of the people to be attracted to and be suited to the boat in more conditions.  All you need is the sails, no need for additional poles, mast sections and so on.

Mike L.




Edited by blaze720 - 06 Mar 15 at 5:08pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 3:49pm
Will the Fire and Halo nats be together, on the theory that the normal Blaze guys can either go big or small, depending on weight and fitness, but join in one or other? You could have sails on a hire purchase scheme. Hire a sail, and if you like sailing with it, you can buy it after the event minus the hire fee.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 4:07pm
Originally posted by Rupert

I was more thinking that you could swap rigs for the weather, even 1/2 way through. I guess the trouble is that unlike 3 guys on a skiff, the weight differences in an Aero are too big compared to the boat for it not to dominate who does well.Not for normal opens, just for sh*t and giggles and a bottle of something.

With Laser events I believe if they swap rigs they get 2 sets of results. This is certainly the way that any Laser Open meeting I have attended works. For Nationals and Inlands I do not believe they allow you to swap part way (I could be wrong though).
Paul
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Post Options Post Options   Quote rb_stretch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 5:18pm
The real question for me is around a series, where someone picking a rig for the conditions is going to be at an advantage over someone who has just one rig, even if it is the biggest.

I'm getting the impression that some clubs and most open series expect you to always use the same sail size. If you use a different size for an event then it is a new entry in the series. This does sound most fair to me I have to say.

However some clubs seem to allow people to swap around without penality, which surely must distort PY reporting a bit.

Finally some clubs use the lowest PY of all the sails which is kind of a half-way house.

Given all classes go to great lengths to be clear on the rules to ensure boats are in class, having 3 alternative solutions to rig swapping can't be healthy. My original fear of multiple rigs effectively pushing out the heavier sailor and/or the sailor who can't afford multiple rigs still stands. Is all of this together a good development for our sport?

Windsurfing got round the multiple rig problem by having minimum wind limits which ensured even the heavy sailors could choose a sail to be powered up with, but look where that took windsurfing!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote craiggo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 6:16pm
So how do you deal with people who reef?

I'm firmly in the sail what you want and score it on helm, but then we don't really have a noticeable fleet of anything. I think club racing needs to be made as attractive as possible.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 6:40pm
Originally posted by craiggo

So how do you deal with people who reef?

I'm firmly in the sail what you want and score it on helm, but then we don't really have a noticeable fleet of anything. I think club racing needs to be made as attractive as possible.

With boats the are designed to be reefed that is fine....none of the boats being discussed allow reefing they are to all intents and purposes different classes.
Paul
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Jeremyc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 15 at 6:42pm
If you change rig, then you change class. The fire rig is used at our club and in wind it is faster than the standard rig on the water and every time it has been honking it has beaten full rig blazes without handicap adjustment. Admittedly, in light stuff it struggles same as any smaller rig, but how do you set the py for it or any other small rig from any class. I once came second sailing a 4.7 in a blow, beating all other lasers across the water, and trust me, I am not 4.7 sized, but it was only rig available at the time for me to use. If they only get taken out when windy then py should be lower than full rig . I daresay that if I did the same with my d zero, then I would also be faster than the full rig when its honking. Trouble is we all want to sail in all conditions, but it is banditry to put up a small rig when it is honking.
Of course I have no idea what the answer is as we all want to enjoy our sailing in whatever conditions, and not being slammed about on the full rig of whatever class we sail as we get older holds many an attraction.....

To be fair, there is one fire rig owner who is using the rig in every afternoon race whatever the conditions to try to build handicap info and I have huge respect for this, but it does not change the fact that any two rig owner of any class who only changes down in the windy stuff is playing the system , though bet they have a nicer sail than those who are over canvassed.

:-)

Edited by Jeremyc - 07 Mar 15 at 7:45am
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