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RS400 proposed changes

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maxibuddah View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote maxibuddah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: RS400 proposed changes
    Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 8:28pm
You could always the crappy Laser trick of painting or anodising if you're keen, masts black. Will look like carbon but one hell of a lot cheaper. Look especially nice when the paint starts to flake off.
Everything I say is my opinion, honest
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Jamesd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 8:25pm
Originally posted by JimC

I would think the main motivation for the changes would be sales figures.

As for mainsail size - firstly the upwind/downwind righting moment balance is out, and secondly the mainsail very heavy on the hands.

Not at all for 'sales figures', this was the CA taking it to LDC not the other way around. LDC needed persuasion that the boat needed updating. 

The mainsail is not too big either, if you set it up right, the 400 has one of the most broad weight ranges of the dinghies out there. If you found it "heavy on the hands" you are clearly not sailing it correctly.


i noticed someone mentioned the mast.........in an ideal world it would be carbon etc, but there is only so much you can change at one time. a carbon rig is a massive performance change at a large cost and asking 1000 boats to switch is too much. In an ideal world this would have been considered 17 years ago, but instead the boat was designed as it was, which proved to be very successful. The issue is, that the boat is looking VERY dated with sailcloth chunky bits of scaffolding etc. It was believed that it needed bringing into the 21st century and this is what has been proposed. 

Obviously the main objective is to get numbers to events. currently the boat is getting 20ish boats to opens, if the class can get ten more then im sure it will gain momentum. it is by no means a dying class, but does have the potential to be in a few years if things arent changed. whether the proposals will do this is another matter.


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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 5:35pm
Originally posted by dopamine

"Get on your knees and then reach as far up the bow as you can, grab the kite in two big handfalls and pull it into the boat. Then throw it back up towards the pointy end and resume sailing".

I never pulled the retrieve in through that turning block but grabbed it straight from the kite, so when I got to the kite there was no interruption. Just need to be a bit wary of pulling/ripping it through the kicker blocks on starboard gybe drops.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote phil wright Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 5:34pm
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dopamine View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dopamine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 5:18pm

Don't really fancy the splintered end of a carbon pole contacting the crews ankle either, but at least it should come in travelling faster than the current piece of scaffolding.

We sailed an L4K last week and even that monster "single line" system was less hassle than the current 400 set up.
 
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RS400atC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 5:04pm
Originally posted by dopamine

What could be simpler than 'pull the release, pull the downhaul as fast as you can'?
 
Err, you've forgotten the next bit:
 
"Get on your knees and then reach as far up the bow as you can, grab the kite in two big handfalls and pull it into the boat. Then throw it back up towards the pointy end and resume sailing".
 
It's a horrible retrieve but it has the advantage that random failures can occur at almost any time to anyone. A new, slick system will condem older boats to a sub fleet. Also, are the wing wangs staying?
 
Quite glad I didn't get new sails this year.
I don't understand how a carbon pole will change any of that?
(except if it splinters when it smacks into the deck strut in front the mast!)
 
Only cure for what you describe so eloquently is either superhuman crew (as an upgrade to 'long suffering') or a nice long kite sock as per RS800. Doesn't have the image factor of a carbon protruberance though, does it!
I think we are allowed a bit of bungie to do the 'throw it up the pointy end' bit?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dopamine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 4:46pm
What could be simpler than 'pull the release, pull the downhaul as fast as you can'?
 
Err, you've forgotten the next bit:
 
"Get on your knees and then reach as far up the bow as you can, grab the kite in two big handfalls and pull it into the boat. Then throw it back up towards the pointy end and resume sailing".
 
It's a horrible retrieve but it has the advantage that random failures can occur at almost any time to anyone. A new, slick system will condem older boats to a sub fleet. Also, are the wing wangs staying?
 
Quite glad I didn't get new sails this year.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sailpics Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 4:44pm
 
Originally posted by RS400atC

   
I don't think the kite system will make drops much different.
What could be simpler than 'pull the release, pull the downhaul as fast as you can'?
Probably my old boat and re-learning a two handed boat after all the years of single or > 2 handed handed boats! Last time I sailed an asymmetric was an H22 or a sunfast 40!  Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 4:30pm
Originally posted by Merlinboy

Alloy boom £229

Alloy sprit £174
Jib £319
main £ 684
 
Thats £1406 in current format (alloy)
I should imagine there will be a reduction in the cost of a new main sail (ala 300) but i would think its going to cost best part of £2k especially if they are looking at new kites as well!!!
Is it worth bothering with on an older boat??  400's tend to start (for an old knacker) at around £1500 now!
 
I bet a new 400 is the best part of £10k, you can get a very, very nice merlin for that money and play development with the big boys!


Yes, but that ~10k would be the limit of your spending on a 400, beyond comparable items like replacement sails. MR front-of-fleet competitiveness may well require further begging at the feet of the bank manager.  Plus, for me, the MR's development since the launch of the 400 has now made them vastly superior, some of these changes to the 400 may help narrow the gap but more importantly will prolong the life of the 400 which is an excellent boat in it's own right.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Matt Jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 10 at 4:22pm
Originally posted by RS400atC

Maybe we should just lead the pole ejector to where the helm can do it?
My first 400 (a few years ago now) had a mod to do this (with a block suspended between the bases of the MS hoop) and I really liked it but reading the class rules recently made me realise this was probably illegal.
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