New Posts New Posts RSS Feed: pumping
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

pumping

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <123>
Author
Rob.e View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 19 Oct 04
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 545
Post Options Post Options   Quote Rob.e Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: pumping
    Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 6:05pm

Yes, RS 's allow you to touch marks at opens, and it can get confusing when you get back to your club! (I've done it).

It's like the Soslow, at the champs you still need a protest flag, and have to do a 720 if you hit a mark, but once back in club racing, standard rules apply.

Back to Top
Matt Jackson View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 04
Location: Darlington
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 962
Post Options Post Options   Quote Matt Jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 6:09pm

The Contender has a marked increase in speed when planing and pumping effectively brings the windspeed at which planing is possible down thus making it a lot more fun. Also if our class rules are based on this then not pumping puts you at a major disadvantage in both class and handicap racing (the PY is based partly on those that pump).... however I don't see how it can be anything other than confusing to allow some classes to pump and other not!

Laser 203001, Harrier (H+) 36
Back to Top
Rob.e View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 19 Oct 04
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 545
Post Options Post Options   Quote Rob.e Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 6:47pm

If you change the rules to allow pumping, that would only apply to class events, so it wouldn't affect the handicap, and at handicap events there is still a level playing field, because standard rules still apply. It does mean you need to be fit at class opens though, guy I know did his first Finn meet, and up went the flag for unlimited pumping allowed....he came home "tired"!!

It does allow you to tailor the rules to suit the type of sailing you want to do,ie if you want fast and furious assymetric racing it makes sense to not worry too much about touching marks, whereas for the Solo's who want tight tactical racing it's important to penalise infringments more heavily. Courses for horses!

Back to Top
laser47 View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work
Avatar

Joined: 11 Feb 06
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 349
Post Options Post Options   Quote laser47 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 6:50pm

i suppose it depends what wind condition you're in. i mean most people were pumping at this years bloody mary and i didn't hear of one protest.

if classes are designed/developed to be pumped then it shouldn't come under a breach of rule 42 should it?

 

Back to Top
gordon View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 07 Sep 04
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1037
Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 7:14pm

Rule 42 does allow pumping - see the exceptions in 42.3 - but only one pump on each sail per wave or gust and only to initiate planing or surfing. The RYA has some good material on the inerpretation of what is and what is not permitted.

As for those who believe "if classes are designed/developed to be pumped then it shouldn't come under a breach of rule 42 should it?" I would recomend that they set up an International Air Rowing Federation and leave the sailors to enjoy real sailing.

The way to solve the problem of cheating - for that is what unauthorised pumping is - is for competitors to render the practise socially inacceptable - for clubs to back them up by providing competent juries and for classes to provide the ressources for on the water judging at open events and championships. I have always found that competitors appreciate the calming effect of a RIB flying a Jury flag on fleet behaviour. Once behaviour in a class gets out of hand it is difficult to return to a more acceptable situation.

 

Gordon

Gordon
Back to Top
jeffers View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 29 Mar 04
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3048
Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 9:16pm
The Finn has a flag that is flown and it is only apllicable in class events. If I saw someone pumping obviously in a handicap race I would warn them (as sometimes people just dont realise) if they took no notice they would get protested!

We had an OOD hrow someone out under rule 42 (as I believe you can without protest).

I agree it should be dealt with, the protesteee will get over it, it may be worth the friendly off the water chat first before you start throwing protest forms around (isn't that what the RYA Racing charter envourages us to do?)

Paul
Paul
----------------------
D-Zero GBR 74
Back to Top
Calum_Reid View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: 09 Apr 04
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 59
Post Options Post Options   Quote Calum_Reid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 9:36pm
In scotland at the rs events we regularly asked the race commitee to not alow RS rules at open events as we dont feel its of a benefit to racing to be allowed to touch marks.

I dont know what the feeling is on this but when a 200 sailor asked if we were allowed to at one event the entire 400 fleet shouted NO very loudly.
Back to Top
Ian99 View Drop Down
Posting king
Posting king


Joined: 07 Apr 05
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 138
Post Options Post Options   Quote Ian99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 10:52pm
The "you can pump above xx knots of wind" rule is mainly there because above a certain windstrength on the sea it becomes very difficult to judge whether someone is pumping or just working the boat down the waves (legally) well. Without good video evidence or a jury, proving someone is pumping rather than working the waves in those conditions in a protest room is almost impossible.
Repetitively pumping the sails in those conditions without any relation to the waves usually makes the boat go slower anyhow as it disturbs the airflow over the sails so much .... and if that doesn't slow you down, a miss-timed pump which starts a nosedive certainly will!!
What is most satisfying though is when you sail straight past someone who is illegally really agressively pumping the spinnaker downwind in a duckpond in lightish winds, with the pumping actually slowing the boat down rather than making it go faster!
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest Group
Guest Group
Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 11:41pm
Personally, I love to pump when no one is looking I do it in all the local competitions on the red sea and I haven't been caught to this day.
Back to Top
gordon View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 07 Sep 04
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1037
Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 06 at 11:44pm

"We had an OOD hrow someone out under rule 42 (as I believe you can without protest)."

Normally a bot can be penalised  for a Rule 42 infringement by the Protest Committee (not the race Officer) without a hearing if a memeber of the committee has seen the incident. The penalty is a DNE. This must be noted in the SIs

 

Gordon

Gordon
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <123>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.665y
Copyright ©2001-2010 Web Wiz
Change your personal settings, or read our privacy policy