Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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List classes of boat for sale |
Ovington Laser |
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Mark Aged 42 ![]() Groupie ![]() Joined: 24 Aug 11 Online Status: Offline Posts: 98 |
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There was a story going around that back in the day, the top sailors went to the factory to pick a hull which gave better mast rake, due to variations in the mast pot installation.
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JimC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6661 |
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There are always a lot of rumours, but mast rake must be a nightmare on unstayed boats because a tiny variation in the step makes for a big variation at the mast tip.
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rich96 ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 20 Jan 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 596 |
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It wasn't just the top sailors - it was quite common Less rake = more potential leech tension |
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tink ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 23 Jan 16 Location: North Hants Online Status: Offline Posts: 789 |
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I imagine the helm balance was also a major factor. It would be very fascinating to know if as rake tolerance was included in the original build manual, if it was added and then if it was changed over time. Interesting when they did the last Olympic single handed equipment trial they didn’t like the D-zero because, and I paraphrase, ‘being able to adjust the mast rake makes the boat more technical to sail and distracts from the athleticism required by the sailor’
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Tink
https://tinkboats.com http://proasail.blogspot.com |
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KazRob ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 22 Oct 16 Location: Scotland Online Status: Offline Posts: 245 |
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It's not just the tolerances on the rake that affect leech tension but also the relative stiffness's of the top and bottom sections which always varied a lot. In an ideal world you would probably want the mast pot to be as upright as possible but with a soft lower section F/A so that the rig is more upright downwind but still raked aft upwind and too section to suit your weight.
There was a nice video of Ovi's on FB which showed them controlling the mast pot rake during construction(within a few mm Chris T says) https://fb.watch/5kMOyTTj9F/
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OK 2249
D-1 138 |
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tink ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 23 Jan 16 Location: North Hants Online Status: Offline Posts: 789 |
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Interesting about the mast stiffness, given relatively simple controls I’m sure it’s easier to produce repeatable alloy masts vs composite but perhaps decades of windsurfer masts have improved composite mast repeatability
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Tink
https://tinkboats.com http://proasail.blogspot.com |
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Oatsandbeans ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() Joined: 19 Sep 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 382 |
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Not really-when you make Al spars they change shape as the extrusion die wears. If the die is new the mast will be significantly different to one made from a die on its last legs. Whereas with composites it is not like that and it is easy to get a consistent stiffness
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KazRob ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 22 Oct 16 Location: Scotland Online Status: Offline Posts: 245 |
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One problem with the alloy masts is they were extruded and the extrusion dies wear over time so wall thickness will vary over time so that can have a big effect on stiffness. Even a +/-5% on wall thickness will give a big change in section stiffness. Conversely, I know from boats like the OK and Finn where mast bend is critical that the carbon mast manufacturers now do really repeatable bend numbers (+/- a few mm).
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OK 2249
D-1 138 |
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tink ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 23 Jan 16 Location: North Hants Online Status: Offline Posts: 789 |
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So it comes down to quality control, as the die wears you replace it. An extension die is a few thousand max and I imagine you get a significant number out of a die. I’m not convinced a simple die measurement is less controlable than precision resin content, wetting out efficiency, fibre alignment, cure temperature and other variables
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Tink
https://tinkboats.com http://proasail.blogspot.com |
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Daniel Holman ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 17 Nov 08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 997 |
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In my time laser sailing, I had top sections weighing between 2.6 and 3.1kgs. Thats the range of the 10 or 15 topmasts I had so the true population will be a bit broader. Thats all in the wall thickness - if you do the sums on inertia, that is a big, big difference which transcends going from a bendy to stiff mast in, say a Solo. So the extrusion tolerances are massive. I heard for the Atlanta games in 1996 the organisers bough 500 sets of spars and cherry picked the 500 closest of each spar to the mean. My knowledeg of composites is that tensile performance of fibre can vary a bit within batches, but will probably even over a spar. Resn fraction can be controlled very precisely in almost all methods even wet lay, so I think that the 2.6 to 3.1kg range will be very, very easy to improve on in composite.
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