The predictability of PYAG

I think the first list are clubs who submitted an old style return, not using the pyonline website. All returns count, but there are so few of the old style returns now they are kinda submerged.

Edited by JimC - 05 Mar 16 at 10:13pm

Chris 249

The NS is very different to Icon.  An over-rotating (highly expensive) fully battened rig on a 'racing snake' narrow hull today mostly suitable to diminuative or emaciated crews makes the NS a bit more 'specialist' than Icon surely.

Nothing wrong with that - if that is what suits you.   We could have as easly used a Merlin hull as a starting point.  But we actualy sailed both ourselves first and leaned slightly more towards the NS.  Despite its positive attributes however it was absolutely hopeless for 'regular' sized folks, lackluste in lighter winds and was needlessly over-complicated rig wise - and expensive. (If you did want a lightweights specialist the National 12 over here already more adaquately fills that slot). We could go on but  life is too short ...  In the end we cannibalised the test NS's for fittings and the hulls remains  probably ended up in a landfill site.

The objective was NOT ever a faster 'NS' or even 'big' N.12 for that matter anyway - but a modern 2-sail simple boat TWO regular sized people of today could enjoy across the wind range... and afford. 

Bottom line is a lot of folks have opinion on handicap - well they always do don't they - often even on boats they have 1) never seen in the flesh 2) never raced against  3) never sailed themselves.  Now tell us which, if any of these categories, don't you quite belong in ? 

Why is their so much discussion on this forum about the icon? Isn't there only about 3 ever made

The icon was an interesting development for many reasons.
Although I was never in the market for a two sail, two person boat, I was very interested in the thoughts behind hull and rig design.
My view would be that comparing it to a Contender is exactly what's wrong with many people's expectation of PY.
When there is enough breeze for a Contender to be in its element, an Icon will be basically overpowered. When an Icon is at its design wind and looking nice, a contender sailor will be tentatively on the wire and looking grumpy.
Both fine enough boats, but very different performance vs windpseed profiles.
Then look at how each is affected by courses...

Originally posted by salmon80 Why is their so much discussion on this forum about the icon? Isn't there only about 3 ever made It seems to me that it gets too much attention

Only because it's another victim of what could either be a trade cartel, a corrupt body, a curmudgeonly agenda, or just plain idiocracy, you choose, but either way the number they gave the Icon is vastly out, and I have sailed it, extensively on all kinds of water and a paltry 7 point increase goes nowhere near, the best comparison could be the Merlin, that consistently beats it whenever their kite is deployed.

Edited by iGRF - 06 Mar 16 at 10:35pm