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iGRF 
Really should get out more 
Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6499 |
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 Topic: D-ZeroPosted: 06 Oct 14 at 3:57pm |
And this is good news? Tell me, write it slowly so I get it, why is being a class affiliated to the RYA any better than just forming an owners association, purr-leaze list all those features and benefits. Seriously I don't get it... ZOG - Zero Owners Group, a much better ring to it. 'Oh no we're the Zero Class Association...' So how's that a Class association of er Zero's I guess, as opposed to what? Hero's?  Edited by iGRF - 06 Oct 14 at 3:58pm |
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Null
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Joined: 11 May 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 745 |
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Posted: 06 Oct 14 at 4:09pm |
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Thanks Graeme, To be honest i have tried to explain several things to you several times and it always falls on death ears. So not really sure why i am bothering, as you only really ever hear what you want to.
A class association or club, or whatever you want to call it can be set up fairly quickly. However we want to operate a class that has its sailing governed by our overarching body. We want rule setsthat are approved and again given merit, we want fair racing which abide to a ruleset, we want to make sure that we are covered and supported at things like the dinghy show. We want democracy so that our members have a say, we want a class with longevity so peoples investments are protected, we want financial stability, we want our place in the dinghy community recognised. More importantly because its the right thing for the D-Zero class and its membership. Joining the association is optional, but supporting the class gives you the benefits above and more. I dont expect you to understand, its fine. you have chosen to sail a boat that has no class association or ruleset. I/We/Everyone can kind of understand that. However many More people prefer to be part of a bigger family, and share in the benefits. As someone which has a commercial background surely you understand that a product or service should suit that of the masses not the minority and i'm afraid you are the minority!
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JimC
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Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662 |
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Posted: 06 Oct 14 at 4:12pm |
Well, its not something I've ever really ever bothered to find out much about but I think you'll find they're spinning a big deal out of something that IMHO is extremely ordinary. AIUI you get to be an affiliated club, association of whatever by paying a small annual fee, and they like you to have 30 members and have a connection with sailing. That's it I think: there's no actual status attached, its not like becoming an RYA National class or an ISAF International one. If I remember correctly (and could easily be wrong) I think the most significant benefit for a CA is a discount on the cost of a stand at Sailboat, but here's the RYA list. http://www.rya.org.uk/infoadvice/clubsclass/afficliate/Pages/whyaffiliate.aspx |
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kneewrecker
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Joined: 09 Apr 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1586 |
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Posted: 06 Oct 14 at 4:19pm |
maybe it's ordinary- but 'spinning' implies there some sort of commercial agenda. FWIW - I think it's just saying that the owners are proud to have got their sh*t-in-one-sock and are trying to do things 'properly', by the book, so to speak. I read it as 'watch this space'.... but then I've got a soft spot for that design, even with the slot closed  and I personally wish Rodney and Dan success with the project. That said, RYA? Yep a bit too 'establishment' - they'll probably f**k it up given half a chance, so I'm with Graeme- Planet Zog sounds perfect, even if it is more of a sound byte for Boris or Nigel than a credible dinghy racing infrastructure.
Edited by kneewrecker - 06 Oct 14 at 4:19pm |
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jeffers
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Joined: 29 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3048 |
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Posted: 06 Oct 14 at 4:20pm |
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A well run Class Association is invaluable.
I guess you could liken it to motorsport. Most motorsport on the UK is run by MSA affiliated organisations. There is a set of standards that need to be adhered to (safety, medical, insurance, organisational). You can find non-MSA sanctioned events but these might not be as well run as one that has taken the trouble to affiliate. I know which one I would rather do......
Enough said! |
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Paul
---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
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iGRF
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Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6499 |
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Posted: 06 Oct 14 at 4:48pm |
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Well I'm obviously playing devils advocate here, I've been a long supporter of the RYA but feel betrayed as regards my home sport. So I come to dinghy world which frankly created the RYA or certainly built it through its main growth phases and all I read, everywhere wether it be the OK class, ourselves, the squad system, the team fifteen, is a total sense of similar betrayal, total lack of interest in grass roots sailing.
It's all about jobs, jobs worths, commercial centres, Olympic overseas jollies, whilst the PY system is in tatters, the sailing clubs neglected, having said all this I do have Bas Edmonds coming to ours to explain the yardstick so that bit I may have to re qualify my complaints, but I aint just yet. So my question still stands, they no longer appear to give a damn about sailing at grass roots, why even bother to affiliate? The Association/ organisation/ owners group, runs itself, you don't need the RYA for that so what perceived benefit is there? A dinghy show discount? Even that is a commercial enterprise these days, we'd be better organising a class association demo and get together on some open water for tryouts... Edited by iGRF - 06 Oct 14 at 4:51pm |
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Posted: 06 Oct 14 at 4:55pm |
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I think it's a fair question. There is no doubt that if you want to set up a racing circuit you need a CA of owners club. But whether that Ca needs to be affiliated to the RYA? Well, it's gets a big discount on a Dinghy Show stand and presumably it entitles you to a PY when the powers that be deem they have enough data. But I do agree that the RYA seems to largely ignore club and mixed fleet racing.
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kneewrecker
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Joined: 09 Apr 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1586 |
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Posted: 06 Oct 14 at 4:59pm |
You presume wrong Peaky.... If enough Affiliated Clubs return enough data for Topper Hulls with Laser Rigs - then the TOSER 'class' would get an entry. PY has nothing to do with Class Associations, Affiliated Class Associations or Owners Groups.
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Null
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Joined: 11 May 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 745 |
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Posted: 06 Oct 14 at 5:00pm |
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Jim, unlike you to make sweeping statements without knowing at least some of the facts. To be an rya affiliated class you need class rules, a constitutions etc. Etc. the message is certainly not spin. We have set up an association which is anything but a commercial message. That class association is ratified and acknowledged by the rya. Very kind of you to belittle the hardwork and commitment of people and their own time....I will remember that next time someone has a pop at the PYAG.
For the membership, it offers stability and the ability to be part of a collection of like minded individuals. In terms of rya benefits, it's just the right thing to do.
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blaze720
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Joined: 28 Sep 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1635 |
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Posted: 06 Oct 14 at 5:08pm |
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As an affiliated class .... and you will very soon get ... an 'EN' for the fee
So what's not great value about that ?
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