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    Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 8:34am
I really hope that the Government allows some easing post 7th May and that this results in people being able to travel short distances to sailing clubs to free sail and do ad hoc informal racing if they wish. We can get changed in our cars and easily social distance in the boat park and on the water although organised racing and mixed family double handers will probably still be off the cards. I really hope this is the case for metal health etc
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mozzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 8:34am
Originally posted by Simon Lovesey

 
My concern is sailing will be treated the same as much broader sectors, so clubs will lumped in with bars and restaurants, and sailing events as festivals. The indications are these broad sectors will only be allowed to restart near the end of any easing of restrictions. In Holland, sailing events are categorised as festivals, which are prohibitive in operating until September at the earliest. 

The RYA are pushing on the cruising side, to allow people access to their yachts and motorboats (see updated RYA Covid page), yet they're still woolly about outright insisting dinghy sailing / windsurf  / kitesurf is reasonable exercise. They also seem to be sticking to the point that sailing is additional risk and the strain on emergency services. Whereas I'd view sailing as a pretty safe sport and overall the health benefits massively outweigh the accident risk, and this becomes more true over longer periods. 

To me, small craft for exercise is an easier 'win' for the RYA than access to cruisers. Many people can use small craft locally. There are many more launching locations for users to spreader out over. And it is very clearly exercise. 

Whereas yacht sailors tend to travel further and marina's, like caravan parks do see a congregation of people using the same co-op, then same marina office, the same shore facilities. Plus it's hard to say cruising is exercise (especially motor boats). Additionally the average yacht owner is a few years older than the average kite-surfer or dinghy sailor, s we're talking about a more 'at risk' demographic. No that any this is insurmountable, but I see more issues. 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 8:41am
Originally posted by Mozzy

But I am asking what is the logic behind it being okay for my wife and I to go for a bike ride this evening, but not a sail.

Rule writing is always the art of the possible. In this case the challenge is to provide a set of rules that 90% of the public will read, understand and broadly accept. If you have twenty pages of detailed rules covering every sport and situation then no-one will read them and you might as well not bother.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mozzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 8:43am
Originally posted by turnturtle

 If I were involved in a regatta or class champ, I'd be cancelling them right now... no question.  It's right to do so, and the only pragmatic solution.

I'm normally in favour of early cancellation. But in these circumstances I don't see any harm in keeping the hope alive. Yes, they are very unlikely to happen and personally I can't see many or any opens this year. However, it's not like an early cancellation allows people the opportunity to go and make other plans. 

Until people are starting to make significant financial investments in the events then I'd keep them pencilled in to the calendar.  Much of the planning is volunteer based and can be carried over to postponed dates anyways. 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 8:43am
Originally posted by Mozzy

 

Because, after the other sacrifices we're making, being told by the harbour board, against government guidelines, that we can't practice what is otherwise a perfect social distancing exercise local to our home. Yes, I am going to question that. 

This is a global pandemic expecting that much granularity in 'the rules' which govern our collective response to suit our individual whims and desires is perhaps expecting a little too much, no?


Governments (and the UK Government especially) are already treading a careful path to protect civil liberties and our sense of freedom and democracy.   Honestly, the UK is second only to Sweden in terms of 'liberal response' from European countries - many questioning it as a sufficient, suitable response if you dare venture into woke-world of lefty Twitter.


What is clear is that for a truly global crisis, government responses have been very localised - there certainly isn't some edict from Brussels like the Brexitards would have you believe would be the case - quite the contrary in fact, the EU advocate localised response.

Closing harbours in the spring might seem petty, but it's comparative to local authorities closing backcountry access in the Alps and no one is really complaining about that, or questioning it. 

No amount of personal risk assessment can take away from the fact that sailing is to all intents and purposes one form of a floating bathtub with a blanket aloft a set of broom sticks.... often without a secondary means of propulsion when it goes to hell and the crew are injured.

The fact you can literally ride this out is a blessing compared to what a lot of us in our small corner of the globe are permitted to do.  It really shouldn't be a reason for a whataboutism for a niche activity like dinghy sailing.


Edited by turnturtle - 23 Apr 20 at 8:48am
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mozzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 8:45am
Originally posted by JimC

Originally posted by Mozzy

But I am asking what is the logic behind it being okay for my wife and I to go for a bike ride this evening, but not a sail.

Rule writing is always the art of the possible. In this case the challenge is to provide a set of rules that 90% of the public will read, understand and broadly accept. If you have twenty pages of detailed rules covering every sport and situation then no-one will read them and you might as well not bother.
The government rules are simple and clear. I can go dinghy sailing, locally for exercise alone or with members of my household. 

The additional granularity is being added the harbour masters, MCA, and RYA all of which are adding extra stipulations on top of what the government is requiring. 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote H2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 9:05am
Mozzy - you are right but also wrong in my view. You are right that the rules as written allow you to walk to HISC which I assume is your local and go sailing with your wife. You are wrong that just because you are proficient and unlikely to get into trouble that sailing should be allowed - the harbour master has to make rules that apply to the majority which means he has to stop muppets going out in a blow up paddle boat and being swept out to sea or whatever. There are plenty of people who think they are great sailors who go for a swim every time the breeze gets up.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote H2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 9:08am
If you will forgive my logic creep - I used to have a Lotus Exige. It could go fast around corners and stop on a dime and I thought I was a good driver, better than average. So should the rules on speeding apply to me because I had a car that weighed less and had massive brakes so surely I could drive faster and stop in time compared to the distracted yummy mummy in her massive 4x4?

Just because YOU can do something does not mean the rules should be written for you rather than the majority!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mozzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 9:22am
Originally posted by turnturtle

Originally posted by Mozzy

 

Because, after the other sacrifices we're making, being told by the harbour board, against government guidelines, that we can't practice what is otherwise a perfect social distancing exercise local to our home. Yes, I am going to question that. 

This is a global pandemic expecting that much granularity in 'the rules' which govern our collective response to suit our individual whims and desires is perhaps expecting a little too much, no?
...

It really shouldn't be a reason for a whataboutism for a niche activity like dinghy sailing.

Like I said to Jim, it's not the government I'm questioning. It's the harbour authorities and MCA who are adding extra to the Governments laws and policy. 

And generally no, I wouldn't expect any granularity in an emergency measure. I don't expect anyone to be distinguishing different forms of exercise. Which is why it is odd that the MCA and Harbour Masters are. 

Either ban exercise outside, or allow exercise outside. 

However, as the lock-down continues I do expect a bit more nuance in the rules. That's why in the first three weeks I wasn't questioning anything asked of me. I could see inconsistencies, but thought, well it's only three weeks we're all in this together etc. etc. Some of what people are asking doesn't make much sense, but best to just pull together. 

However, as time goes by and the dust settles why can't we discuss the merits of how certain rules have been applied or are being supplemented by NGO's and government offices? 

If social distancing rules will apply for the year, then we have time to look in more detail about what is really helping, and what isn't. 

Also, a lot has changed and can change about how we conduct day to day life. The risk people going to the sailing club in March 2020, pre-covid conditioning, versus now, when we've all had social distancing, hand washing and the like hammered in to us by 24 hour news for a month is different.

So yes, until someone can give me a logical reason why going cycling tonight with my wife is okay, but we can't go for a sail because the harbour master has made up a new rule. I am going to ask the harbour master how is their arbitrary rule helping in the fight against Covid. 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mozzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 20 at 9:35am
Originally posted by H2

Mozzy - you are right but also wrong in my view. You are right that the rules as written allow you to walk to HISC which I assume is your local and go sailing with your wife. You are wrong that just because you are proficient and unlikely to get into trouble that sailing should be allowed - the harbour master has to make rules that apply to the majority which means he has to stop muppets going out in a blow up paddle boat and being swept out to sea or whatever. There are plenty of people who think they are great sailors who go for a swim every time the breeze gets up.

But, people are fine taking up cycling. Wiggle / Evans are reporting massive shortages of bikes because so many people have bought new. 

I consider myself pretty competent at cycling, but I've ended up in an ambulance / A&E from that. 

I think harbour masters, coastguard and the RYA should issue guidance. Saying now is not he time to take up a new unfamiliar sport. To stay well within your comfort zones. To stay close to home in familiar waters. That mirrors what cycling organisation have been largely saying. 

My fundamental belief is that outdoor activity, despite the risks, long term will see more people avoid health care. There will be people that need rescuing afloat by the coastguard and RNLI. But there will be less people who need recusing by the health professionals in the community.
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