V Twin

Originally posted by G.R.F. I'm taking a total newcomer, MD of a local company, I'm going to teach him to sail and crew for me in the Alto, would I have a hope in hell of doing that in a 505? No, not a chance and even now after 8 years and I'm not exactly a newcomer to sailing, would I go near anything as complex as that, it's needlessly complex in this day and age.

Well its not for me to tell you what you should enjoy, and for what its worth I think the Firefly and Lightning stand the test of time much much better than most.
It is an inevitable truth that the sport will die if new boats are not sold - living on a diet of second hand boats is not sustainable, eventually they will rot away and/or become so antiquated that only an eccentric would consider them.

In a day and age when Apple has redefined what a consumer can expect from a product, it is unrealistic to expect a newcomer to spend the best part of 10k on something that was clearly designed before they were born - possibly before their parents were born - whilst telling them this is as good as it gets. It is obvious, to me at least, that modern designs *should* be better than older designs, if only due to standing on the shoulders of giants. This is true of all things, not just boats, and by better I do not necessarily mean faster or lighter, but better in whatever way is appropriate. Only someone raised on a diet of salt water could look at a Solo and think "I've gotta get me one of those". They look old fashioned now, and in another 20 years they will look like museum pieces. The perpetuation of old designs does no good for the future of our sport - it closes the game to the outside world and keeps it the preserve of those who already play.

Originally posted by sargesail I have been waiting to find the time to launch in to a counter-blast to this drivel, but I will confine myself to the fact that I now believe the root of GRF's dinghy problem to be that he has no background/understanding of seamanship, which is not required in his other sport.

Niceley said Pondmonkey, you have just neatly summed up all my recent posts. Also, if you sail on a smallish 'pond', like me, then light boats are not always what you need. How many times did we blow off three or four GP's in our Tasar only to have them cruise back past us into a wind shadowed mark?
At our little club Mark Giles is king, 9 Supernova's (and 2 new ones on order) with 4 Lightnings. Mark Giles sailed at West Oxford and he designed what small lake sailors wanted. Of course we should have development and innovation otherwise we stagnate but let us not throw the baby out with the bath water.

Originally posted by Presuming Ed Originally posted by G.R.F. I'm taking a total newcomer, MD of a local company, I'm going to teach him to sail and crew for me in the Alto, would I have a hope in hell of doing that in a 505? No, not a chance and even now after 8 years and I'm not exactly a newcomer to sailing, would I go near anything as complex as that, it's needlessly complex in this day and age. That's odd, I never had problems taking complete novices out on my five oh. Sail around for a bit then get them out on the wire. Not a bad first ever sailing experience.