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Windward mark to port

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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Windward mark to port
    Posted: 09 Oct 06 at 8:43pm
OK, this happened on Sunday. I'm coming into a mark, on the layline, on port and tacking round it to port. A boat which has over stood the mark comes down from the windward side on a close reach (also on port) and demands water. Am I right in thinking that I don't have to give him room, as it is a windward mark, even though he would have water at another mark? I forced him to tack off and go round, as I was always taught that at the windward mark you take the mark away, and then you have a windward boat situation. Am I right, or have the rules changed, or was I always wrong?
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les5269 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote les5269 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Oct 06 at 8:51pm
If I'm reading it right, I  would say that as your both on port ,he's windward boat so has to keep clear, but I'm a little confused how he could be coming in from windward and on port .
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Lukepiewalker View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Lukepiewalker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Oct 06 at 8:52pm
I'm fairly sure it has always been the case that boats in that situation would have to give room, as long as you are overlapped at the two boat circle, ovbiously. 

Edited by Lukepiewalker
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Oct 06 at 9:07pm

Originally posted by les5269

If I'm reading it right, I  would say that as your both on port ,he's windward boat so has to keep clear, but I'm a little confused how he could be coming in from windward and on port .

Really difficult to describe, easy to draw. He has over stood the mark, and is reaching down to it. Do I have to bear away from the mark, having got the lay line right, or can I carry on and make him go the wrong side. Obviously, I can't on a leeward mark, but on a windward mark it would seem that I was being punished for getting the angles right?

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Lukepiewalker View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Lukepiewalker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Oct 06 at 9:12pm
As I said, if he doesn't have an overlap at the two boat length circle you can push him up (subject to giving room to keep clear), but if you are overlapped then you have to let him round inside.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Lukepiewalker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Oct 06 at 9:14pm
The rules don't distinguish between windward marks and other marks.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 06 at 8:08am

Originally posted by Lukepiewalker

The rules don't distinguish between windward marks and other marks.

Yes they do, but not in the situation described. Rule 18 does not apply between boats on opposite tacks at a windward mark. Since both boats were on port here, rule 18 does apply and the windward boat was entitled to room.

When This Rule Applies

Rule 18 applies when boats are about to round or pass a mark they are

required to leave on the same side, or an obstruction on the same side,

until they have passed it. However, it does not apply

(a) at a starting mark surrounded by navigable water or at its anchor

line from the time the boats are approaching them to start until

they have passed them, or

(b) while the boats are on opposite tacks, either on a beat to windward

or when the proper course for one of them, but not both, to

round or pass the mark or obstruction is to tack.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 06 at 8:11am

Originally posted by Rupert

it would seem that I was being punished for getting the angles right?

No, you are being punished for approaching a port-hand windward mark on port, because it puts a windward boat on the inside.

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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 06 at 11:45am
Fair enough Stefan! Though it would have been difficult on this particular course to do anything else. Luckily, it is a situation that comes up rarely.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tornado435 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 06 at 12:00pm
Happened to me on saturday. Scary when it's tornado's and you've also got a row of Starboard boats coming into the mark. Still it was made a lot better by the fact that the Starboard boats were Leigh Macmillan and Rob Wilson.
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