Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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Laser 161752 Tynemouth |
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Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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List classes of boat for sale |
David Henshall's article |
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craiggo ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 01 Apr 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1810 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 18 Dec 14 at 10:54pm |
I've read Davids excellent article Radical thinking twice today and found it incredibly interesting. One view I have is that the focus of innovation has moved away from the boat and more towards the rig, but not really in terms of manufacture more in terms of control. My view is that the skills shortage seen within industry is having an impact in sports and social contexts. This is largely driven by the promotion of computational methods and academias desire to be seen to keep up with the times coupled with ever reducing budgets which limit the ability to provide people with hands-on experience. Individuals like Dan Holman are few and far between within his generation, sure many have the theoretical backgrounds afforded by engineering degrees but how many younger sailors are able to do any more than a simply gel-coat repair on their pride and joy? Sadly I fear the answer is not many. Most of the so-called innovators in our sport are either deceased or progressing towards their senior years.
A second point is that I think the 'right first time' culture that seems to be demanded in most R&D organisations, stifles development and true innovation. Current generations are too scared of failure, so developments are small, controlled and with minimal risk. Going back to rigs then, most of the recent developments are centred around multi-component adjustment which makes use of off the shelf components, so the activity is largely theoretical with little risk of failure as if it doesn't work you just lock it off and sail as if you had a non adjustable rig. So I dont think we will see large scale innovation and development until young people start getting their hands dirty again and for this we are going to have to be using readily available, easy to use materials. Unfortunately I dont see it coming any time soon. Radical thinking Edited by craiggo - 18 Dec 14 at 10:56pm |
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iGRF ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6499 |
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I read it and thought he still doesn't get it really does he?
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JimC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662 |
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I dunno that things were much rosier 25 years ago really. I can recall ranting at the show about huge effort being made into what might make a boat 1% faster to the exclusion of what might make it 10% faster...
I also recall back in those days meeting an RYA guest of honour, whose name I have shamefully forgotten, but who had sailed with Uffa in the 30s. He was, inter alia, criticising all the boats were 'too damn heavy'. Happily our Cherub met his approval, but it's sobering to think that he would probably make similar complaint at the show now. |
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Rupert ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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Interesting article. Gets a bit bogged down with Merlins (radical within restricted rules can never be truly radical) but certainly food for thought.
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Null ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 May 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 745 |
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Exactly my thoughts, I lost interest at the merlin part. But interesting none the less.
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winging it ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 22 Mar 07 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3958 |
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I know nothing, but will 3D printing have an effect?
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the same, but different...
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maxibuddah ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 06 Mar 09 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1760 |
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Not at the moment other than for small components. Once the printers for metal get cheap enough then you just make replacements, might put a chandlery out of business,...but u doubt it.
I don't think at the moment the printers are large enough to make a boat though, maybe a radio controlled one, but not laser size. |
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Everything I say is my opinion, honest
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iGRF ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6499 |
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Pretty much my point, what's radical in constraining yourself within the bounds of a clinker built hull and wasting all that effort to make it fractionally faster and with all due respect Jim, much as I admire the Cherubim, another couple of feet on the hull length or the ability to use tail foils would stop all that bucking and tail walking.
What's needed to be truly radical is a less narrow set of rules, but then again I guess all you'd then end up with is an AC style weapons race. So as well intentioned an articles as it was, there's nothing I would call radical, but then again my view of radical tends to differ from most. |
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NHRC ![]() Posting king ![]() Joined: 13 Dec 13 Location: Lymington Online Status: Offline Posts: 102 |
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For the last fifteen years I have raced yachts far more than dinghies. In that time I have seen a massive drop in technical knowledge. The do it yourself culture is gone. Not just the mad scientist designer boffin types, there are still a few about, but the practical boat owner too.
The amount of dinghy owners who send their boat to someone to get it prepped, or the people that only buy replacement ropes from their dinghies manufacturer because they don't know how to set the systems up. It's very sad. On this forum and many others I offer my help and advice for free on rope work and rigging matters. I have been a professional in that industry for a long time. I am glad to tell you that most of the questions I am asked are by the youth sailors, under 25s and the like who want to do it themselves, to understand how it works, and to save a few quid. I think the Laser 4000, Rs400, ISO etc, the one design budget high performance boat, era are very much to blame for this technical knowledge gap....! You can customise and personalise your boat so much more in Fireballs, 505s, Scorpions and Merlins. Things have to move forward, from my point of view the most exciting classes are still the I14s, Moths and Cherubs that develop technological advances and breed intelligent sailors. |
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NHRC ![]() Posting king ![]() Joined: 13 Dec 13 Location: Lymington Online Status: Offline Posts: 102 |
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I disagree on the arms race idea... The article discusses the Merlin class where Winder have a huge monopoly over the other designers and manufacturers in the fleet. A new Merlin to compete at the top of the fleet is nearly £20k and it is effectively, (sadly) a one design class now. |
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